39 replies to this topic

[Loomis]

I already accept the link between this Bond and the Fleming character (one and the same).

I don't. To quote Jim (writing in the thread "IFP Announce "Young James Bond" series"):

I do hope they examine how little Jamie Bond frae Glencoe became:-

A bigot
A racist
A sixty a day smoker
A misogynist
A murderer
A SM fantasist
A borderline alcoholic
A programmable killing machine corrupted by the demands of a changeable political artifice

because they might be slightly unusual as children's books. I do hope they do that. I do.

Bet they won't.

And wasn't James Bond thrown out of Eton for (basically) shagging a maid? Is that going to be in there?

Bet it'll be son of Q making super-duper things in "the lab" and good-hearted girls from Carshalton Beeches and whizzo prangs and ginger beer, shaken not stirred. "The scent and smoke and sweat of a wendy house become nauseating past your bedtime"*. Yeech.

No, "SilverFin" is fun, but Fleming's Bond? Nope. Not even close.

*Note that Higson actually wrote this (or something very close to it).

[David Schofield]

I already accept the link between this Bond and the Fleming character (one and the same).

I don't. To quote Jim (writing in the thread "IFP Announce "Young James Bond" series"):

I do hope they examine how little Jamie Bond frae Glencoe became:-

A bigot
A racist
A sixty a day smoker
A misogynist
A murderer
A SM fantasist
A borderline alcoholic
A programmable killing machine corrupted by the demands of a changeable political artifice

because they might be slightly unusual as children's books. I do hope they do that. I do.

Bet they won't.

And wasn't James Bond thrown out of Eton for (basically) shagging a maid? Is that going to be in there?

Bet it'll be son of Q making super-duper things in "the lab" and good-hearted girls from Carshalton Beeches and whizzo prangs and ginger beer, shaken not stirred. "The scent and smoke and sweat of a wendy house become nauseating past your bedtime"*. Yeech.

Note that Higson actually wrote this (or something very close to it).

No, "SilverFin" is fun, but Fleming's Bond? Nope. Not even close.

S***, I've been very articulate this morning.

Loomis, what I mean on the issue of "genuine" Bond is the INTENTION for us to believe it Fleming's Bond: my take on having the book in hardback that it will feel more appropriate as a Bond novel.

As far as Fleming's Bond goes, well I guess that's down to how one sees "canon" Bond. Some people think Benson's Bond is Fleming, others that Bond not penned by Fleming is not Bond.

For my few cents worth, Higson's Bond is as just as much Fleming's Bond as Benson - IF you chose it to be.

Me, only that written by Fleming is Fleming Bond. Though I do wrestle with including Colonel Sun and James Bond, the Spy Who Loved Me.

But that's my take.

[Loomis]

Loomis, what I mean on the issue of "genuine" Bond is the INTENTION for us to believe it Fleming's Bond

Oh, sure, the intention is definitely there: the publisher's blurb explicitly paints "SilverFin" as a prequel to the books "Casino Royale" - "Octopussy".

But it strikes me as - how to put this politely? - false advertising, since "SilverFin" just doesn't read remotely like any "young Bond" adventure Fleming might have written. It doesn't chime in the least with "Casino Royale" - "Octopussy". Hard to imagine anyone reading, say, "Goldfinger", and then reading "SilverFin", and thinking: "Wow, 'SilverFin' does a splendid job of detailing the early years of the hero of 'Goldfinger'! Higson is clearly writing about the exact same character Fleming created! Higson shows you how Bond became a bigot, a racist, a 60-a-day smoker...."

"SilverFin" seems more like a prequel to Gardner's Bond than a prequel to Fleming's: Bond girls with mindblowingly outrageous names (Wilder Lawless), villains with Nazi sympathies, and, I'm afraid, quite a bit of dullness (and Bond going up against a mad scientist laird in a Scottish castle is very "Licence Renewed").

[David Schofield]

Loomis, what I mean on the issue of "genuine" Bond is the INTENTION for us to believe it Fleming's Bond

Oh, sure, the intention is definitely there: the publisher's blurb explicitly paints "SilverFin" as a prequel to the books "Dr No" - "Octopussy".

But it strikes me as - how to put this politely? - false advertising, since "SilverFin" just doesn't read remotely like any "young Bond" adventure Fleming might have written. It doesn't chime in the least with "Dr No" - "Octopussy". Hard to imagine anyone reading, say, "Goldfinger", and then reading "SilverFin", and thinking: "Wow, 'SilverFin' does a splendid job of detailing the early years of the hero of 'Goldfinger'! Higson is clearly writing about the exact same character Fleming created! Higson shows you how Bond became a bigot, a racist, a 60-a-day smoker...."

"SilverFin" seems more like a prequel to Gardner's Bond than a prequel to Fleming's: Bond girls with mindblowingly outrageous names (Wilder Lawless), villains with Nazi sympathies, and, I'm afraid, quite a bit of dullness (and Bond going up against a mad scientist laird in a Scottish castle is very "Licence Renewed").

Indeed, the whole tag of IFP to written-Bond is to make us believe it is Fleming's Bond (as opposed, I guess, to unauthorized fan fiction). And of course, it is mostly "false" advertising. Though no more in Higson's case than Benson or Gardner. All three sanitise Bond to such an extent it is unlikely, if you changed the name and gave him a copy of the manuscript, Fleming would recognise the character. It's largely why I really do wish the grotesque campaign that are the continuation novels was laid to rest. However, IFP wont and it is why I have my Bond world as described in my previous post and why some blieve Ian Fleming's Bond appears (as Tony Blairs favourite agent!) in the Man With The Red Tattoo.

[Loomis]

I really do wish the grotesque campaign that are the continuation novels was laid to rest.

If only those books were better. By and large, they're awful. While I enjoy the odd thing like "Zero Minus Ten", "The Man With the Red Tattoo" and, indeed, "SilverFin", decent continuation novels are very few and far between. For me, the literary Bond really ended with "Colonel Sun".

[DLibrasnow]

Sorry, fellas, I am going to still pass on this one.  I am going to wait patiently for someone to write more books when he maimed, killed, and screwed with the best of them.

Your loss ChandlerBing . Personally, as soon as I was done reading SILVERFIN I was anxiously awaiting the release of the second one.

[David Schofield]

[quote name='DLibrasnow' date='18 April 2005 - 11:56'][quote name='hrabb04' date='17 April 2005 - 19:45']Sorry, fellas, I am going to still pass on this one.

[DLibrasnow]

[quote name='David Schofield' date='18 April 2005 - 07:06'][quote name='DLibrasnow' date='18 April 2005 - 11:56'][quote name='hrabb04' date='17 April 2005 - 19:45']Sorry, fellas, I am going to still pass on this one.

[David Schofield]

[quote name='DLibrasnow' date='18 April 2005 - 12:23'][quote name='David Schofield' date='18 April 2005 - 07:06'][quote name='DLibrasnow' date='18 April 2005 - 11:56'][quote name='hrabb04' date='17 April 2005 - 19:45']Sorry, fellas, I am going to still pass on this one.

[DLibrasnow]

Everything I have read has suggested that Higson will be foloowing the Fleming continuity - he just plans on ignoring the works of the continuation authors - which is fine with me.

Certainly there are plenty of adult elements to SILVERFIN. I was actually troubled while reading the book that some of the stuff in that novel was a little too adult for kids.