40 replies to this topic

[DLibrasnow]

I disagree with you here Loomis, sorry but I like THE FOURTH PROTOCOL a lot more than THE LONG GOOD FRIDAY!

[spynovelfan]

The gay thing is a trademark of the novelist, Frederick Forsyth. There's a very similar scene in THE DAY OF THE JACKAL if you remember - the Jackal pretends to be gay to have somewhere to stay. In fact, PROTOCOL is nearly a step by step retread of JACKAL, with Brosnan as the Jackal and Caine in the Lebel part trying to find him before he completes his mission. Brosnan even sleeps with a woman and kills her straight after - just as the Jackal does. Unlike JACKAL, there's a possibility he might succeed (we all know De Gaulle wasn't assassinated); but nevertheless the book doesn't have the suspense of JACKAL, and neither does the film. I think one of the problems is that the script doesn't give Brosnan enough to play with. The Jackal was just as cold-blooded and ruthless. In THE EYE OF THE NEEDLE, Donald Sutherland's Nazi agent is cold-blooded and ruthless. But in both of those films, part of you actually wants them to get away with it. You don't really want Brosnan to get away with it. I don't think this was PB's fault, though - I think he's easily the best film about the film.

[marktmurphy]

Don't forget 'Protocol' has (I presume the book was written first) its villainous plot ripped off wholesale for 'Octopussy'!

[spynovelfan]

Don't forget 'Protocol' has (I presume the book was written first) its villainous plot ripped off wholesale for 'Octopussy'!

That's true! But then it's hard to know who's ripping off who sometimes. In OCTOPUSSY, the weapon is smuggled by a travelling circus. In TOPKAPI, a circus is used to hide a stolen dagger. In TORN CURTAIN, a circus is used to smuggle people out of East Berlin. And arguably every single book or film - including THE FOURTH PROTOCOL - that features a race to find a nuclear device has stolen from THUNDERBALL. And so on.

Edited by spynovelfan, 25 April 2005 - 02:31 PM.

[Loomis]

You know which Forsyth book is crying out to be filmed (properly, I mean - from what little I've seen of it in clips on TV, the Christopher Walken movie doesn't exactly look like a faithful adaptation)? "The Dogs of War". Clive Owen would be perfect for Shannon, and keeping the "twist" ending is a must!

[spynovelfan]

You know which Forsyth book is crying out to be filmed (properly, I mean - from what little I've seen of it in clips on TV, the Christopher Walken movie doesn't exactly look like a faithful adaptation)? "The Dogs of War". Clive Owen would be perfect for Shannon, and keeping the "twist" ending is a must!

The version with Walken was pretty faithful, from what I remember. As faithful as can be on film, anyway - the book has at least 50 pages of expositional dialogue.

[Loomis]

You know which Forsyth book is crying out to be filmed (properly, I mean - from what little I've seen of it in clips on TV, the Christopher Walken movie doesn't exactly look like a faithful adaptation)? "The Dogs of War". Clive Owen would be perfect for Shannon, and keeping the "twist" ending is a must!

The version with Walken was pretty faithful, from what I remember. As faithful as can be on film, anyway - the book has at least 50 pages of expositional dialogue.

Granted, I haven't seen it, but the Walken film doesn't strike me as faithful at all. The basic story may (or may not) be the same as that of the novel, but, for starters, the hero undergoes a change of name (instead of Carlo Shannon, Walken for some reason plays Jamie Shannon) and nationality (yep, he's American in this movie), enough to ring alarm bells in my book. I've also seen scenes in the United States that aren't in the novel.

[DLibrasnow]

Always wanted to see the film of THE ODESSA FILE from 1974. Has anyone here seen it?

Yes it shows up quite regularly on American cable tv. Good movie, pretty suspenseful and Voight does a great job.

[Melanie]

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[Safari Suit]

I just watched this for the first time, and was surprised to find it to be a little gem. This is definitely a thriller for adults, though thankfully it isn't as excessively dry as I feared it might be. Politically, the film may occasionally veer into tastelessness, but I have to commend any thriller which tackles the kind of issues this one does. It has actually aged very well if you take it as a period piece; we even get a contemporary Radio 2 jingle! Pierce is very good as the villain; a real bastard though, and wouldn't you know it, there is even an attempt at peeling back his layers! Caine is as good as ever, and the late Ian Richardson is superb as a very intimidating intelligence chief.

A couple of my favourite scenes showcased the utter contempt between Caine and his superior, played nicely by Julian Glover. They are really at each other's throats. If they are going to insist on having these kind of scenes between Dench and Craig in future Bond films, do it like this!

Of the many, many Michael Caine films that have been given away free with newspapers in the UK over the last five years, this is one of the best.

Highly recommended

[marktmurphy]

It's good fun; I like these 80's UK thrillers- never great but often entertaining.

Don't forget 'Protocol' has (I presume the book was written first) its villainous plot ripped off wholesale for 'Octopussy'!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's true! But then it's hard to know who's ripping off who sometimes. In OCTOPUSSY, the weapon is smuggled by a travelling circus. In TOPKAPI, a circus is used to hide a stolen dagger. In TORN CURTAIN, a circus is used to smuggle people out of East Berlin. And arguably every single book or film - including THE FOURTH PROTOCOL - that features a race to find a nuclear device has stolen from THUNDERBALL. And so on.

I know I'm replying back in time a few years(!) but there's more to it than that- the villain's plan is detonate a nuke on a US Air Base so that they'll be forced to disarm as a prelude to a Russian invasion. There's even high rankers on the Russian side who disagree with the plan in both!

But then as a kid I thought- after Octopussy, A View To A Kill, Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom and Young Sherlock Holmes- that all films featured mines, underground temples full of evil followers, elephants, and sequences where the main characters have a disgusting banquet; so I take your point that everyone borrows from everyone!

Fourth Protocol would be amazing with more elephants...