55 replies to this topic

[DLibrasnow]

Okay, a graphic torture scene may pass the American censors (who care more about keeping the amount of sex down on the screen), but could we see the first 18 rated 007 movie in the UK (where violence is the biggest movie taboo).

Let's also not forget that whereas here in the US kids can see R-rated movies (which always seems a little strange to me), in the UK the 18 rating means just that.

I remember having to take ID to a showing of the 15-rated "Bervely Hills Cop 2" back in the late 1980s and watching all the people under 15 being turned away.

[Righty007]

Casino Royale will be PG-13 in the United States of America.

[Qwerty]

I expect it will go for the 15 rating as Licence To Kill did.

[Loomis]

could we see the first 18 rated 007 movie in the UK (where violence is the biggest movie taboo).

No way. Commercial suicide. I'm told that the British Board of Film Classification threatened LICENCE TO KILL with an 18, but gave it a 15 after the filmmakers agreed to cut it.

I think all the Brosnan films have been 12s. Seems you can get away with quite a lot of violence in the 12 category, judging by the fact that TERMINATOR 3 was given a 12 (although I really can't understand why - it clearly should have been a 15). Then again, MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE II is a 15, and, again, I can't for the life of me see why it's not a 12.

I hope (but don't expect) that they'll go for a 15 with CASINO ROYALE, though.

[Mister Asterix]

[mra]Don

[Loomis]

As DLibrasnow points out, the British censors are very tough on violence. They even excised a headbutt from ATTACK OF THE CLONES! I think all of the Brosnan films were censored: a kick to the head trimmed from TOMORROW NEVER DIES, Xenia's butting of Natalya removed from GOLDENEYE, the downmixing of the thwacking sound of punches during fight scenes (hey, too loud and you'll give the kids ideas)....

Curiously enough, though, you can see Bond ripping a woman's bikini top off and strangling her with it, with her bare breasts briefly visible and closeups of Bond looking like he's really getting off on what he's doing, and of the woman looking terrified and in pain.... in a film to which the BBFC gave a PG rating, DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER. Now that just beats me hollow.

[DLibrasnow]

could we see the first 18 rated 007 movie in the UK (where violence is the biggest movie taboo).

No way. Commercial suicide. I'm told that the British Board of Film Classification threatened LICENCE TO KILL with an 18, but gave it a 15 after the filmmakers agreed to cut it.

Yes, the filmakers did agree to cut LICENSE TO KILL in the UK so that the BBFC would not slap an 18 certificate on it. You are right, an 18 would prohibit anyone under that age from going to the movie (even the 15 obviously hurt LTK) and would lead to greatly reduced box office for the picture.

[IndyB007]

Go ahead and make the next 007 movie rated R or NC17... Bond isn't for children anyway, they have their own Young Bond books...

I mean, just look at how I turned out watching and reading 007 at such an impressionable age!

[J J]

Purvis and Wade wrote a torture scene for TWINE. I don't (dare to) expect this one to be more graphic or spectacular...

[DLibrasnow]

Curiously enough, though, you can see Bond ripping a woman's bikini top off and strangling her with it, with her bare breasts briefly visible and closeups of Bond looking like he's really getting off on what he's doing, and of the woman looking terrified and in pain.... in a film to which the BBFC gave a PG rating, DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER. Now that just beats me hollow.

At the time of the release of LICENSE TO KILL, John Glen gave interviews in which he said they had been told by the BBFC that they couldn't get away with things they had shown in the past.

[DLibrasnow]

Go ahead and make the next 007 movie rated R or NC17...

The problem with that is that a number of US theater chains refuse to show NC-17 movies - no matter how commercial they might be. Still....the US censor doesn't seem to care about violence.

If an 18 certificate was slapped on CR, I am assuming this would effectively prevent some of CBn's UK teenage members from seeing the movie when it is released.

I remember many younger Bond fans being vocally upset that LTK got a 15-certificate because it meant they had to wait until it debuted on video to see it. (check 1989 issues of "007" magazine).

[Gabe Vieira]

Ya, it won't matter how good Casino Royale is if it's rated R because it would severely cut back on total gross. But, I do suggest that CR is written and filmed with all intention of being an R-rated film, release the PG-13 version in theaters and on DVD, then wait a year or so to release the "Unrated Version" or "Director's Cut" of Casion Royale. That way it would increase the total income on the movie for the studio, and we could get a glimpse of the real Casion Royale.

Oh, and for all you Kill Bill fans: Quentin Tarantino will release Kill Bill: The Whole Bloody Affair (1 and 2 in one film) in wide release later this year- and it's now NC-17.

[SPECTRE ASSASSIN]

Interesting observation, Gabe.

[Blofeld's Cat]

I don't thikn that the torture scene will be graphically violent, but just graphically insinuated like when Sanchez whips Lupe in the Licence To Kill pre-credits.

[DLibrasnow]

That whipping scene was cut from the UK print though Brett.

Even though you don't see anything other than the sound of the whip and Lupes expression, the UK cut ends as Sanchez is taking the whip out.

There are no shots of Sanchez whipping Lupe and (if memory serves me correctly) the off-camera screams of Lupe's lover are not heard.

[Scottlee]

All that stuff is certainly on the LTK DVD. I watched it the other night.

I agree however with the point about trimming the film for the cinema (give it a 12), and then putting stuff back in for the DVD, if that's possible. I'd love to see a meaner, grittier, nastier Bond film with a 15 or an 18 certificate, but I understand that the teenage fanbase is a big one and needs to be catered for.

Curiously enough, I was one of those kids who wanted to see LTK and couldn't because I was only 9 years old. My dad arranged for me to see the film without knowing of the 15 certificate. Luckily for me, I wasn't as big a Bond fan back then as I am now.

[Johnboy007]

Doesn't matter, i'd be old enough to see it alone if needed (My parents aren't really fazed by me seeing R-rated movies, I saw The Rock in Theatres whenever it came out, I couldn't have been older than 8). I don't think a man getting drilled repeatedly is going to bring down an R-rating, unless they happen to show a frontal view, and Bond's not wearing any pants.

[DLibrasnow]

Doesn't matter, i'd be old enough to see it alone if needed (My parents aren't really fazed by me seeing R-rated movies, I saw The Rock in Theatres whenever it came out, I couldn't have been older than 8).  I don't think a man getting drilled repeatedly is going to bring down an R-rating, unless they happen to show a frontal view, and Bond's not wearing any pants.

I don't think US fans have to worrry. The US censor is more concerned with sex.

The problem is for UK fans. The censor in the UK is more concerned with violence.

[Snake]

I would like it to be a 15 or 18. That would be class, especially Martin Campell is doing it. GoldenEye is one of the better ones of the new ones. And for me, these 2 new candidates are very unknown, Daniel Craig and Julian McMahon. They would put shame to Bond's name. I would prefer Clive Owen or Ewan McGreggor, as well as Christian Bale.

[DLibrasnow]

these 2 new candidates are very unknown, Daniel Craig and Julian McMahon.

I wouldn't be able to watch McMahon and not think of him as Cole from the TV show "Charmed."

[Qwerty]

[quote name='DLibrasnow' date='17 March 2005 - 10:19'][quote name='Johnboy007' date='17 March 2005 - 06:58']Doesn't matter, i'd be old enough to see it alone if needed (My parents aren't really fazed by me seeing R-rated movies, I saw The Rock in Theatres whenever it came out, I couldn't have been older than 8).

[Snake]

these 2 new candidates are very unknown, Daniel Craig and Julian McMahon.

I wouldn't be able to watch McMahon and not think of him as Cole from the TV show "Charmed."

He doesn't even look like a Bond. Nor does Daniel Craig. They're just people who are supporting actors, like henchman, not the main character like Bond.

[JackLordIsFelix]

I don't think it would work commercially, although it might be great artistically. U.S. theatres are starting to actually enforce the rating regulations (far more than in the Eighties, DLibrasnow, when you and I grew up). And the studios are reacting accordingly by keeping many of their action features within PG-13 limits, whereas the same films could have been rated R 20 years ago and not be hurt financially one bit (raise your hand if you saw Rambo in the theatre even if you were under 17).

[DLibrasnow]

I grew up in the UK where it has always been strictly enforced.

But I remember being amazed that young kids here in the US were in R rated movies back in the late 1980s/early 90's.

[Blofeld's Cat]

[quote name='DLibrasnow' date='16 March 2005 - 09:58']That whipping scene was cut from the UK print though Brett.

Even though you don't see anything other than the sound of the whip and Lupes expression, the UK cut ends as Sanchez is taking the whip

[Pussfeller]

I prefer a hefty dose of sex and violence. Where can we get that?

[DLibrasnow]

I don't think US fans have to worrry. The US censor is more concerned with sex.

The problem is for UK fans. The censor in the UK is more concerned with violence.

However, the UK censors seem to have the right idea, in my opinion.

I agree also...I think one of the reasons America is such a violent society is because the population has become immune to the effects of it. A friend of mine had a gun pulled on her by a 13 year old kid yesterday...

How a kid that young even gets his hands on a gun is beyond me.

[Pussfeller]

I don't think Americans are necessarily more violent than Britons. We're just far more public about it, just as you're more open about sex. Incidentally (not that you didn't already know this) it's way easier to get a gun in the U.S. The NRA and their allies are inordinately powerful, and politicians see it as taboo (and "left-wing" or "Un-American") to go against them. That's one of the reasons I'm always uneasy when visiting the states (especially a place like Texas, where, to quote a bumper sticker, "gun control means using both hands").

[Blofeld's Cat]

I prefer a hefty dose of sex and violence. Where can we get that?

Fleming's books.

[Snake]

I just read the torture scene today. If wasn't much but it would hurt, being slashed with a cane. Unless there's another torture...
Who was that SMERSH bloke? Is he in the next book/s? Or will you keep it a secret?