47 replies to this topic

[zencat]

Originally posted by Loomis
Then again, THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS was supposedly originally written for Moore, and maybe the scene with the girl on the yacht was a hangover from a draft from the less realistic and more jokey Moore era.

Roger officially retired on Dec 3, 1985, before the script was written. I've always heard TLD was written with a "generic", younger Bond in mind. This makes sense. I don't think anyone would have written a scene with Roger as a sniper assassin.

[Loomis]

Originally posted by zencat

Roger officially retired on Dec 3, 1985, before the script was written. I've always heard TLD was written with a "generic", younger Bond in mind.  

I guess the story that TLD was written for Moore must be another of those fan myths, then. You must have heard it before, right, zencat?

[zencat]

I've heard it here on the forum before, and I tried to shoot it down then. I think someone posted that Roger was asked back for TLD, but declined. Not true. Like I said, Roger retired in Dec '85 (I remember this so well because he retired on my 21st birthday). "Bond 15" was developed as an introduction to a new Bond from the start. There was even a James Bond origin story treatment written.

But you're right that there were certain Roger Moorish moments written into the script because they weren't sure if the new Bond would be in the Moore mold or not.

[Loomis]

Originally posted by zencat

"Bond 15" was developed as an introduction to a new Bond from the start. There was even a James Bond origin story treatment written.  

That's right. I've just remembered the making-of documentary on THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS DVD. Michael Wilson and others were considering writing something about a young Bond, but Cubby Broccoli nixed the idea. I'm glad he did: I don't want to see the Bond series equivalent of THE SUM OF ALL FEARS.

[SeanValen00V]

Bond is a one woman man, not all the films got it right, but Timothy's did!This gave more room to tell a story as well, TLD and LTK great story telling.

[Jaelle]

For the record, here's a quote from Dalton on this matter:

Q: You are also famous for being the monogamous Bond...
A: If you really think about it, he's only really had one girl in all the films and in all the stories. There's always been some lovely girls around, but he's only ever had one central love interest.

Also, Dalton once said he didn't think that Bond having sex with Lupe was fair because it meant being unfaithful to Pam. He felt that Bond was focused on one woman per adventure and that it was Pam who was supposed to be the woman for him in LTK. On the other hand, on a UK talk show he mentioned how beautiful Talisa Soto was and how he didn't mind at all taking several takes doing the love scene with her.

[Loomis]

Originally posted by Jaelle

Also, Dalton once said he didn't think that Bond having sex with Lupe was fair because it meant being unfaithful to Pam.  He felt that Bond was focused on one woman per adventure and that it was Pam who was supposed to be the woman for him in LTK.  

Bond's romp with Lupe made sense in terms of the story, though. At that point, 007 thought that Pam was a traitor, having seen her in Sanchez's office. So even Dalton's Bond wouldn't have felt like being faithful to her.

[zencat]

See, when I first watched the film, I though Bond having sex with Lupe would turn out to be his fatal mistake. He had so carefully maneuvered his way into Sanchez's world and had won Sanchez's trust...but as we saw in the opening, having sex with Sanchez's girl is the ultimate betrayal. But James Bond can't resist a woman...and it would have been cool if Lupe turned on him afterward, revealing that she sort of gets off on the "attention" she gets from Sanchez when she cheats. Now that's a twist!

But, no. Dario shows up and that's fine too. But I would have gone with the deadly Lupe turn myself.

[Jaelle]

Originally posted by Loomis


Bond's romp with Lupe made sense in terms of the story, though. At that point, 007 thought that Pam was a traitor, having seen her in Sanchez's office. So even Dalton's Bond wouldn't have felt like being faithful to her.

Good point, I agree entirely! Tim wasn't thinking of that when he made his statement.

Anyway, everyone seems to diss Dalton's love scenes whereas I happen to love the scene in the ferris wheel car when it stops and he takes her in his arms. It's not just him but Maryam who makes that scene work (for me anyway). I do agree, tho, that it's the weakest part of his films.

[Jaelle]

Originally posted by zencat
See, when I first watched the film, I though Bond having sex with Lupe would turn out to be his fatal mistake. He had so carefully maneuvered his way into Sanchez's world and had won Sanchez's trust...but as we saw in the opening, having sex with Sanchez's girl is the ultimate betrayal. But James Bond can't resist a woman...and it would have been cool if Lupe turned on him afterward, revealing that she sort of gets off on the "attention" she gets from Sanchez when she cheats. Now that's a twist!
But, no. Dario shows up and that's fine too. But I would have gone with the deadly Lupe turn myself.

Yours is a much more interesting idea. When I first saw the film I too thought "oh oh, he's in trouble now. Look at what Sanchez did to that poor guy in the beginning! You can't trust her!" I think they missed out on a more interesting direction there.

[Tarl_Cabot]

"The implausibility (to put it mildly) of 007 taking it easy with a babe just after a major security breach had occurred, with the murder of a Double-0 and the possibility of enemy agents still in the area"-Jaelle

But that was an intense 5 minutes and after narrowly escaping death I imagine Bond would want to a have couple drinks to calm the nerves and perhaps even take advantage of this lovely and very availbale woman. He might have been training for 2 weeks for that excercise so he's been away from any lovers has has in London....Bond is all about living life to the fullest because he knows he may be killed in the line of duty anyday so he plays hard.He drinks well, eats well and has a great sex life, sans apologies.I say he absolutely had a fling with that woman on the boat.

[Tarl_Cabot]

He needs Lupe to get over on Sanchez. She was already willing to help him with her silence and info she provided.He knows she needs to be free of him. She can't just leave a man like that. So, Bond has sex with her and gains further alligence but he will ultimately save her from him. He was right to ****her!

[Jaelle]

Originally posted by Tarl_Cabot
"The implausibility (to put it mildly) of 007 taking it easy with a babe just after a major security breach had occurred, with the murder of a Double-0 and the possibility of enemy agents still in the area"-Jaelle

But that was an intense 5 minutes and after narrowly escaping death I imagine Bond would want to a have couple drinks to calm the nerves and perhaps even take advantage of this lovely and very availbale woman. He might have been training for 2 weeks for that excercise so he's been away from any lovers has has in London....Bond is all about living life to the fullest because he knows he may be killed in the line of duty anyday so he plays hard.He drinks well, eats well and has a great sex life, sans apologies.I say he absolutely had a fling with that woman on the boat.

Actually, that wasn't my quote. I haven't weighed in on this topic yet (I've got lots of time today, so I'm just rolling along...)

I always thought that he had a fling with her too but it *is* incongruous with his immediate concern over what has just happened to the mission. Well, he does have a little time before anyone comes to pick him up... I'll fence sit on this one.

[Loomis]

Originally posted by Tarl_Cabot

But that was an intense 5 minutes and after narrowly escaping death I imagine Bond would want to a have couple drinks to calm the nerves and perhaps even take advantage of this lovely and very availbale woman. He might have been training for 2 weeks for that excercise so he's been away from any lovers has has in London....Bond is all about living life to the fullest because he knows he may be killed in the line of duty anyday so he plays hard.He drinks well, eats well and has a great sex life, sans apologies.I say he absolutely had a fling with that woman on the boat.  

One of his colleagues in the elite Double-0 section has just been murdered, as has a British soldier. Bond may have managed to kill the assassin, but how does he know that he didn't have accomplices who are still in the vicinity? Also, M is in the area (albeit up in the air) - what if a plan is afoot to murder the head of the British secret service, too? What if someone's hiding somewhere on Gibraltar with a missile, ready to down M's plane? The **** has totally hit the fan, and Bond has a job to do. He should be hurrying to rendezvous with the other members of the British secret service and military, helping them to search the area with a fine toothcomb and ensure M's safety, not faffing about with a woman on a yacht! If I'd been M, I'd have said to Bond when he bothered to show his face again: "What the bloody hell have you been doing? You'd better have a damn good explanation for why it took you two hours to turn up! Do you have any idea of the magnitude of the security breach that has just happened?"

Anyway, what makes you think Bond trained for two weeks prior to the Gibraltar exercise? Even if he did, he might still have managed to get laid the night before. But even if he hadn't had a woman in ages, Bond is a professional, not a sex maniac. His job would have been his number one priority at a time like that.

[Tarl_Cabot]

In the books these types of excercises have a back story; training is usually required, at least a longer brief than M's short speech before they jump out. A successful mission requires preparation...Anyway it was just conjecture...

[Jaelle]

Originally posted by Loomis
One of his colleagues in the elite Double-0 section has just been murdered, as has a British soldier. Bond may have managed to kill the assassin, but how does he know that he didn't have accomplices who are still in the vicinity? Also, M is in the area (albeit up in the air) - what if a plan is afoot to murder the head of the British secret service, too? What if someone's hiding somewhere on Gibraltar with a missile, ready to down M's plane? The **** has totally hit the fan, and Bond has a job to do. He should be hurrying to rendezvous with the other members of the British secret service and military, not faffing about with a woman on a yacht! If I'd been M, I'd have said to Bond when he bothered to show his face again: "What the bloody hell have you been doing? You'd better have a damn good explanation for why it took you two hours to turn up! Do you have any idea what kind of security breach has just happened?"

You make perfect sense. Sounds absolutely rational to me. But since Dalton's great sin was in making James Bond act more rationally and realistically--thus turning off mass audiences--the writers felt they had to add this scene in. I've never understood the rigid refusal to accept a Bond who *doesn't* screw every female in the vicinity at every moment, despite the consequences, but that apparently was Dalton's great crime.

[Dr.Carl Mortner]

"Brosnan had only 2 lovers in Goldeneye: That unattractive and anal retentive doctor(easily the least sexy Bond girl ever) and Natalya. No sex with Xenia, the most exciting woman in the film...I liked Natalya alot though."

Get outta here! I thought that psychiatrist was a subtle hottie - the kind I love! I woulda done her;P...

[Tarl_Cabot]

I thought she was ok in the real world world but for a Bond girl? Comon! She was complaining the whole time. And bland looking... I wanted Bond to hit the eject button!