79 replies to this topic

[Guy Haines]

Regarding the "direction" of the next villain - well, we've had the standard brand Bond villain types from the books and early films. The "destroy the world to save it" characters. The "I'm better than Bond" versions - Scaramanga, Trevelyan, Silva, for example. And "realistic" types such as Sanchez. So what are we left with?

 

Mention was made on another Cbn thread - "worst villain" - of casting an adversary who makes Bond look bad. Which I interpret as 007 battling a villain who in any other scenario would be a "good guy". Not an out and out irredeemable evil person but an otherwise honourable person who has been driven to do something very bad for what he or she thinks are very good reasons.

 

The example I'm thinking of is from the 1990s actioner "The Rock" - General Hummel (Ed. Harris) - threatening San Fransisco with chemical warfare in order to force the US government compensate the families of Special Forces personnel killed in "deniable" missions abroad. How, I wonder, would Bond deal with that?

 

(Of course, we know - he broke into Alcatraz, having previously broken out, and helped Nicholas Cage finish off the bad guys - Sean Connery playing this "Bond" who ended up  a renegade.)

[tdalton]

Regarding the "direction" of the next villain - well, we've had the standard brand Bond villain types from the books and early films. The "destroy the world to save it" characters. The "I'm better than Bond" versions - Scaramanga, Trevelyan, Silva, for example. And "realistic" types such as Sanchez. So what are we left with?

 

Mention was made on another Cbn thread - "worst villain" - of casting an adversary who makes Bond look bad. Which I interpret as 007 battling a villain who in any other scenario would be a "good guy". Not an out and out irredeemable evil person but an otherwise honourable person who has been driven to do something very bad for what he or she thinks are very good reasons.

 

The example I'm thinking of is from the 1990s actioner "The Rock" - General Hummel (Ed. Harris) - threatening San Fransisco with chemical warfare in order to force the US government compensate the families of Special Forces personnel killed in "deniable" missions abroad. How, I wonder, would Bond deal with that?

 

(Of course, we know - he broke into Alcatraz, having previously broken out, and helped Nicholas Cage finish off the bad guys - Sean Connery playing this "Bond" who ended up  a renegade.)

 

I think that kind of villain is something that EON needs to explore in a Bond film in the near future, especially one with an actor of Craig's quality in the role of Bond.  Taking the excellent example of The Rock, having a character like General Hummel, who really isn't that bad of a guy as movie villains go, go up against a ruthless and violent Bond like Craig would make for a very interesting contrast.  We've seen how Bond deals with his problems, but pitting him up against such a villain (especially when one considers that Hummel's paid mercenaries are the real villains of the film), would make for a very interesting contrast.

[Guy Haines]

Good points, tdalton. Every so often we get an actor playing a Bond villain saying "he isn't really a villain". I think Javier Bardem said something about Silva that there was more to him than villainy, and he was right. Nevertheless, he blew up MI6 HQ in the film, shot his former lover and tried to kill "M". Hardly someone who is not bad, just misunderstood. Whereas Hummel was carrying out a military operation in pursuit of a "worthy cause", even if the threat if his demands weren't met was horrible, and his associates were dubious.

 

Could a future Bond film go down the route of 007 facing a villain like him? I wonder? It would certainly blur the line between "Bond=good" and "Villain=evil" if we saw 007 routinely exercising his licence to kill on behalf of the good guys and his adversary exercising restraint - not harming anyone, relying on the threat of worse to come in pursuit of his "noble" goal.

 

(And Ed Harris is one actor I enjoy watching on screen, and it would be interesting to see him as a Bond opponent.)

[Iceskater101]

I think we should have a woman villain. I mean we have had somewhat woman villains before.. (Electra was a good example) I think it could work.

[tdalton]

Good points, tdalton. Every so often we get an actor playing a Bond villain saying "he isn't really a villain". I think Javier Bardem said something about Silva that there was more to him than villainy, and he was right. Nevertheless, he blew up MI6 HQ in the film, shot his former lover and tried to kill "M". Hardly someone who is not bad, just misunderstood. Whereas Hummel was carrying out a military operation in pursuit of a "worthy cause", even if the threat if his demands weren't met was horrible, and his associates were dubious.
 
Could a future Bond film go down the route of 007 facing a villain like him? I wonder? It would certainly blur the line between "Bond=good" and "Villain=evil" if we saw 007 routinely exercising his licence to kill on behalf of the good guys and his adversary exercising restraint - not harming anyone, relying on the threat of worse to come in pursuit of his "noble" goal.
 
(And Ed Harris is one actor I enjoy watching on screen, and it would be interesting to see him as a Bond opponent.)

 
I think that what really made Hummel a compelling character comes down to (SPOILERS for the few people who haven't seen The Rock) the big climactic standoff between him and the mercenaries towards the end of the film.  I thought that the idea of Hummel's entire plot being a bluff was brilliant, and really paints him not to be the horrible person that we're used to our villains being portrayed as.  I mean, just looking at the film, the heroes of the film far more damage to San Francisco than Hummel.  They practically destroyed an entire section of the city chasing Sean Connery through the streets.  Granted, that chase was done for the action quota and for some laughs, but I think that that's something that could really be examined in a more serious way in a Bond film, with Bond doing more damage to the greater good, in order to "save" it, than the villain himself actually ends up doing.

 

I think we should have a woman villain. I mean we have had somewhat woman villains before.. (Electra was a good example) I think it could work.

 

Agreed.  It would be nice to have a female villain who is the film's lead villain and who is the villain from the outset of the movie, something that we haven't had in the entire franchise's history.  The only two female villains we've had, Rosa Klebb and Elektra, are either part of a sizeable ensemble of villains (Klebb/Grant/Blofeld/Kronsteen) or is painted as a victim before later being revealed as the mastermind behind the plan all along (Elektra).  It would be great to have a female villain who is the villain of the piece as well as being acknowledged as the villain from the outset of the film, rather than trying to make it a twist at some point during the proceedings.

Edited by tdalton, 27 February 2014 - 04:39 PM.

[Pushkin]

 

 

 

If we're going to have a female villain (and I hope that we do), she needs to be an original character who can stand up on her own merits, rather than being a character called Blofeld.  With regards to Mirren, I think she would be far too obvious a choice.

Agreed. But will Eon be able to resist to media coup of bringing back Blofeld - and this time it's a woman [insert name of famous / obvious actress here]....

 

With the success of SF i hope they don't feel they need such stunt coverage, but who knows?

 

 

If they do feel the need to bring Blofeld back, I'd much prefer an overblown, upfront announcement of it, rather than a 'clever' and clumsy 'twist' reveal of the character, as with Moneypenny in SF.

 

 

Agreed.  The whole Moneypenny thing was one of the worst-kept secrets out there, not made any better by the fact that they kept lying to us about it when it was a foregone conclusion that she was playing Moneypenny.  

 

 

Thanks to my naïveté, I never bought any of those rumours and forgot about them... they came back to me just a few seconds before she said it. I was also dismissive of the rumours of Fiennes as M. Unfortunately, before I went to the movie I wanted to look up something about M on wikipedia and then saw his name there as one of the actors who portrayed M. But, it's becoming harder and harder for movies to keep twists secret, and harder for people to avoid spoilers even when they want to.

[Shrublands]

It seems that Travolta's account is very accurate. This is what Barbara Broccoli had to say about talking with him about playing a Bond villain. 

 

"...we talked about doing it at some point, it’s not going to be this one because the story isn’t suitable but I’d love to work with him, he’s fantastic.”

 

http://www.euronews....ic-bondmobiles/

 

So, Travolta's "They’re going a different way with their villain in this next film" and him being unsuitable for what they have in mind does give us an important clue, I'd say.

[SecretAgentFan]

Oh.  Well, then...

[S K Y F A L L]

Interesting. Still don't see it happening though. 

[Shrublands]

I don't think it will happen either - ever. 

But it makes me even more highly suspicious that we'll see a female villain in Bond 24 (or Blofeld).

[tdalton]

I don't think it will happen either - ever. 

But it makes me even more highly suspicious that we'll see a female villain in Bond 24 (or Blofeld).

 

I just can't see Travolta as a Bond villain either. 

 

And, I agree, that this makes me think that it's even more likely that we'll be seeing a female villain.  I really hope that ends up being the case.

[JamesPup]

I've already heard about this and stated it in another thread months ago. I am welcome to John Travolta being a Bond villain. Not sure what the villain will be like in the new movie but I know I will love the movie. I wonder if Travolta if pick and probably not will have his head shaved? I like the idea of a femlae villain but a female Blofeld? That is strange. It is the first I have heard of the idea. I think Blofled should be male and like the old one. I don't mind a female villain though. I'm all out of ideas as to what a villain would be like except for one. What about Russia's invasion of Crimea. Perhaps something like that with Russia invading a country and Neo Nazis on the other side and fascism. Not that all people in Crimea are fascist. There can be the threat of genocide and a bloody war between countries. Not sure how Bond would fit in but he could try to make everyone happy I guess. Not that easy a thing with a country like Ukraine that is split. I just came up with another villainous plot. What about something like 9/11 and the possible missing Malaysian plane 370 conspiracy that the plane was hijacked. What if planes are disappearing in midair? It would need a bigger plot to it. Like the planes are to be used to bomb buildings and possible carry a nuke? Real far fetched but thats what people are believing is happening. It could put Bond into the Middle East.

 

P.S. I can live with a female Blofeld!

Edited by JamesPup, 31 March 2014 - 11:09 PM.

[Iceskater101]

I want a female villain that's seductive. Like Sophie Marceau but more evil and sexy. 

[Hansen]

I want a female villain that's seductive. Like Sophie Marceau but more evil and sexy. 

Sexier than Sophie Marceau ?!!?

[S K Y F A L L]

I just don't see what Travolta can do that 10 other better actors could do... The producers I think are just saying 'nope not for us.'

[SecretAgentFan]

Travolta can be a very effective actor, doing things no other 10 better actors can do.

[Agent 76]

 

I want a female villain that's seductive. Like Sophie Marceau but more evil and sexy. 

Sexier than Sophie Marceau ?!!?

 

it's possible 

 

[SecretAgentFan]

Maybe we interpreted it wrong when BB was quoted that they were going a different route with BOND 24 and therefore Travolta could not be the villain.  Instead of a female villain they might want a black villain?

[tdalton]

Maybe we interpreted it wrong when BB was quoted that they were going a different route with BOND 24 and therefore Travolta could not be the villain.  Instead of a female villain they might want a black villain?

 

I think that Barbara Broccoli was probably just being polite in letting Travolta down easy. 

 

Still, it would have been great if we could have gotten a female villain, as that news would have been far more exciting.

[Shrublands]

Maybe we interpreted it wrong when BB was quoted that they were going a different route with BOND 24 and therefore Travolta could not be the villain.  Instead of a female villain they might want a black villain?

 

I think you are right there.