53 replies to this topic

[Licence_007]

I was never in any doubt as to the fate of Koskov.

However,I tried the trivia quiz and I have a couple of questions about it. Number one, am I correct in thinking Dr.No was boiled alive not buried? And number two, didn't Dr.No start SPECTRE and not Blofeld as the quiz says?

[dinovelvet]

I was never in any doubt as to the fate of Koskov.

However,I tried the trivia quiz and I have a couple of questions about it. Number one, am I correct in thinking Dr.No was boiled alive not buried? And number two, didn't Dr.No start SPECTRE and not Blofeld as the quiz says?

Hmm...he boiled/drowned in the film, but was buried alive in the book. Blofeld was the leader of SPECTRE, Dr.No identifies himself as a member of it.

[Red Barchetta]

I was never in any doubt as to the fate of Koskov.

However,I tried the trivia quiz and I have a couple of questions about it. Number one, am I correct in thinking Dr.No was boiled alive not buried? And number two, didn't Dr.No start SPECTRE and not Blofeld as the quiz says?

Hmm...he boiled/drowned in the film, but was buried alive in the book. Blofeld was the leader of SPECTRE, Dr.No identifies himself as a member of it.

And, that asks another question: Was Blofeld himself once a member of SPECTRE before becoming it's leader?

Edited by Red Barchetta, 14 March 2008 - 04:08 AM.

[Agent Spriggan Ominae]

Hm, if the Cork/Stutz 'Bond Encyclopedia' is the book to go by (and one should think that the makers of this Quiz were provided some kind of 'official' guideline), Koskov's status is "Arrested, probably executed by the KGB". So much for that

I believe I mentioned this in the other thread, too: In the German version, Pushkin says "Send him back to Moscow - as diplomat's ashes"

That's interesting. Although the KGB offcially denied it, there was a lot of rumors and talk coming from defectors that those unfortunate enough to be considered among the KGB's "worst traitors" were burned alive. There was a story I read of a GRU Colonel who was arrested and tried by the KGB for passing secrets to west. The account of his execution says that he was bound to a wooden plank with piano wire and slowly feed him feet first into a crematorium while his family and friends were made to watch. Apparently a film of the excution was also made and shown to KGB recruits as a deterant.

Rather sinister and chilling stuff. While the Bond films attempt to potray the KGB in a somewhat neutral light, we musn't forget that the KGB in real life, was a very unforgiving and brutal organization.

[Double-Oh Agent]

I always thought he was arrested and being sent home to Moscow for execution, although I can see where the phrase "diplomatic bag" is code for body bag. But there is no way he could simply be arrested with all that he's done against Russia before.

[MarcAngeDraco]

Guess I've always assumed that he was probably executed, never worried much about whether it was before or after the flight to Moscow...

When I took the quiz, I was given a question about the material used in Kamal Khan's loaded dice. Choices were platinum, mercury, etc... Not sure how we were supposed to know the answer to that...

[marktmurphy]

I had the same question. But the 'correct' answer when I did it turned out to be Thunderball!



As for Koskov; it's pretty obvious he was bumped off, isn't it?

Yes. I'm surprised there's much debate here. Amongst his other crimes (misuse of state funds, diamond smuggling, drug trafficking), Koskov participated in a plot to assassinate Pushkin, which probably warrants an instant execution, wouldn't you think?

Maybe in real life, but this is a film, and at that point in a film an execution feels a bit unnecessary.

[DaveBond21]

Guess I've always assumed that he was probably executed, never worried much about whether it was before or after the flight to Moscow...

To me, it was always a body bag, hence the horrified look on Koskov's face.

[Guy Haines]

I always thought that Koskov remaining alive and well after being hit by that aircraft in Afghanistan was a bit far fetched, so I'm with those who thought his role in TLD ought to have ended there. I think bringing him back in Tangier at the end might have been a holdover of the script having been written initially with a lighter style of Bond in mind than Timothy Dalton. I'd have preferred a longer battle with Brad Whitaker instead. Interesting character, Whitaker, but woefully underused (and loosely based, I remember reading in Time magazine's review of TLD, on the real life renegade arms dealer Edwin P. Wilson, an ex-CIA man who based himself in Libya and sold weapons to that government.)

As for internet quizzes - I wonder who sets them and how they can get away with so many howlers. Someone once showed me an internet quiz answer site, and I asked it the question "Who was the last man to walk on the Moon?" It provided me with the name of the fourth man instead. Certainly not garbage in, but definitely garbage out! That said, as a pub quiz veteran, I'd remind you all of the time honoured rule of such quizzes, as quoted by a friend who used to run them: "Rule 1 - The quizmaster is always right, as are the answers on his quizsheet. Rule 2 - in the event that he or the quizsheet are wrong, Rule 1 applies"

[Double-Oh Agent]

I always thought that Koskov remaining alive and well after being hit by that aircraft in Afghanistan was a bit far fetched, so I'm with those who thought his role in TLD ought to have ended there. I think bringing him back in Tangier at the end might have been a holdover of the script having been written initially with a lighter style of Bond in mind than Timothy Dalton. I'd have preferred a longer battle with Brad Whitaker instead. Interesting character, Whitaker, but woefully underused (and loosely based, I remember reading in Time magazine's review of TLD, on the real life renegade arms dealer Edwin P. Wilson, an ex-CIA man who based himself in Libya and sold weapons to that government.)

Yeah, they should have showed Koskov jumping out of the jeep before it hits the plane instead of after to make it more believable. My other problem with that scene is when the collision is about to happen, Koskov jerks the wheel to the right which in the next shot shows would send the jeep toward the body of the plane instead of away from it toward the wing, which is idiotic. Of course, the natural instinct is to swerve away from the bigger obstacle, not into it.

By the way, I love Brad Whitaker too. Very amusing character who is vastly underused.

[Mr_Wint]

I think bringing him back in Tangier at the end might have been a holdover of the script having been written initially with a lighter style of Bond in mind than Timothy Dalton.

Is there anything you can't blame on Roger Moore...?

[Mr. Blofeld]

Is there anything you can't blame on Roger Moore...?

Yes; you.

I agree with Guy; they should've cut away, and Koskov'd be dead, then and there -- end of story, one loose end wrapped up, and now Bond can focus on Whitaker.

[Guy Haines]

I think bringing him back in Tangier at the end might have been a holdover of the script having been written initially with a lighter style of Bond in mind than Timothy Dalton.

Is there anything you can't blame on Roger Moore...?

I'm not blaming anyone. But I think that the film was initially envisaged as a vehicle which would carry on in the style of the previous few movies. I recall reading it was written for "James Bond", but at the time Bond was played in a different way from Dalton. It was only when it became clear that Dalton was a darker, more serious version of Bond that certain scenes didn't make it to the finished product (the magic carpet, for instance). I'm suggesting that Koskov making it to almost the final reel was one scene that the film makers decided could stay in, even though it is debatable whether it was necessary.

[Matt_13]

Still a bit confusing to me how he survived that truck explosion.

[DaveBond21]

Still a bit confusing to me how he survived that truck explosion.

Yes, it was very confusing on first viewing but also if you forget about it and don't watch TLD for a while, one just assumes he must be dead.

[AMC Hornet]

I remember seeing The Living Daylights at the cinema and Pushkin's "diplomatic bag" line getting quite a few laughs. I think the portrayal of Koskov and the actor's comedy reaction to this led me to believe that he was going to get roughed up a bit rather than bumped off. I really like TLD but always felt that Koskov was a lightweight villain and the "altogether now" happy ending let it down a bit.

..Actually, thinking about it, the ending is a bit surreal. Bond and Kara going at it in her dressing room, whilst MI6 hob-nob in the lobby with the Taliban,who are a bit peeved at missing a classical recital. As the man said "Bond. Only Bond...."

I always took the "diplomatic bag" line to mean that Koskov was to be smuggled out of Tangier back to Moscow without being identified. He would still stand trial for misuse of state funds, but since his 'defection' had never been officially acknowledged by the KGB, everything he did while out of Russia would not be brought up as charges. Koskov's surprised look was because he thought he'd fooled Puskin with all his blather about being kidnapped, but Pushkin's mention of the diplomatic bag was so dismissive that Koskov knew he was not off the hook. I suspect he was sentenced to a Gulag, where he remained even after the change of government a few years later.

By the way, Hilly, Kamran Shah and his people were only ever identified as the Mujahadin. True, they were responsible for putting the Taliban in power after the Russian withdrawal, but I suspect that once they realized they had been betrayed, they continued to fight for true Afghan freedom (just my take).

[Guy Haines]

I've sometimes wondered whose side Kamran Shah would have been on, had the character returned in a future Bond film. For example, if more Dalton films had been made and the character reappeared, as Zukovsky did in the Brosnan era. Indeed, Kamran could have returned when Pierce Brosnan was Bond, and be played by Art Malik (precedent - David Hedison as Felix Leiter in LALD and LTK, with two different actors as Bond).

But would he have been Bond's ally or, in the different circumstances of the 1990s or early 2000s, Bond's (reluctant?) enemy? An Oxford man to be sure, with a cut glass accent, but an Afghan patriot first and foremost. If Bond had had cause to return to that part of the world, would Shah have welcomed him with open arms or would he have taken up arms against him this time? Post re-boot, we will never know, but it might have been an interesting character twist.

[General G.]

Koscov would've been transported -- alive -- to Lubyanka (KGB) Prison in Moscow for gruelling interrogation -- after which he would be executed (a single bullet in the back of the neck).

That was the KGB way... especially for a "traitor"/state criminal of Koscov's magnitude.

He's quite dead.

[Zorin Industries]

No. He is not dead or about to be. That would be too easy. KOSKOV was a whore for his trappings and luxuries. He simply will not have access to them. That is death enough to a character like him.

[Royal Dalton]

He's taken outside and shot. Bit of a waste them having him survive the jeep explosion and then do nothing afterwards, though. Might have been an idea to have him square off against Bond after Whittaker's death.

I've sometimes wondered whose side Kamran Shah would have been on, had the character returned in a future Bond film.

They probably would have made him a member of the United Front (aka the Northern Alliance). The supposed "good guys" in Afghanistan.

[Guy Haines]

He's taken outside and shot. Bit of a waste them having him survive the jeep explosion and then do nothing afterwards, though. Might have been an idea to have him square off against Bond after Whittaker's death.

I've sometimes wondered whose side Kamran Shah would have been on, had the character returned in a future Bond film.

They probably would have made him a member of the United Front (aka the Northern Alliance). The supposed "good guys" in Afghanistan.

I can't quite imagine Koskov squaring off against Bond at the film's end. He didn't strike me as the most courageous of Bond villains, even though, in fairness, some of the things they had him do took some guts. But he didn't seem to me to be a natural combatant (hence the ever present Necros when the action moved to Afghanistan.) He would more likely have tried to weasel his way out of a confrontation with Bond, before trying to escape.

Despite being a great Bond film, one problem with TLD was the lack of a traditional Bond adversary, imo. Koskov started off a victim, before being revealed as a villain, then at the end pretended to be a victim again. The screenwriters may have recognised this, hence the other villain Brad Whitaker, who seems more like the typical Bond bad guy. But as I noted earlier, Whitaker has too few moments on screen (although Joe Don Baker made the most of them.) For me it didn't seem that 007 was battling a clearly defined enemy so much as being deceived by a trickster all the time. Not the typical Bond-v-villain scenario at all.

I think you are probably right about Kamran. Like Zukovsky, his status would be "ambiguous", but probably still leaning Bond's way.

[SecretAgentFan]

But from the beginning Koskov is the double-faced liar, only manipulating others instead, mostly avoiding to make his hands dirty. So, to me, the ending always made perfect sense and was very satisfying. And just by featuring not one traditional villain TLD scored with me much more.

[Genrewriter]

Still a bit confusing to me how he survived that truck explosion.

I've always looked at that bit as one of those things you just have to roll with when watching an action movie. Makes me chuckle, though.

[Guy Haines]

But from the beginning Koskov is the double-faced liar, only manipulating others instead, mostly avoiding to make his hands dirty. So, to me, the ending always made perfect sense and was very satisfying. And just by featuring not one traditional villain TLD scored with me much more.

Koskov was, as you quite rightly point out, a double faced liar and a manipulator, hence I can't honestly picture him facing down Bond at the end in the way these villains usually do. He would try and trick his way out, rather than fight, even if such trickery was entirely useless by the end of the film.