12 replies to this topic

[Vodka Martino]

A pointless thread, and my apologies if this has already been discussed, but I was thinking the other day that, if Ian Fleming were a modern author writing a Bond novel today, "Skyfall" would have been the kind of story that he would have written. It pretty much distilled Bond back down to gadget-less and serious, despite the one-liners which (thankfully) didn't dip into the "Moore is less" gag bin.
And then I began to wonder what Mr. Fleming would have made of "Skyfall", with its strong notions of what it means to be British and the idea that the old methods are still needed in the modern world.
Just thinking out loud.

[007jamesbond]

I would he would love the British theme and culture in this film.......the willingness to kill off a main character and a villain that is different and has some physical disability

Many common Ian Fleming themes such as traitor and good vs evil that has explored further I believe

[Dustin]

There already is a lot of Fleming in SKYFALL, probably more than in many Bond films of the last two-and-half decades. While being an original story it's also an inverted remake of both book and film of TMWTGG. I suppose Fleming would have liked the Western allusions of the final act, with Bond having to make do with what he finds at Skyfall. He'd probably also have liked the cinematography, giving the whole thing such a distinctive look, which is not an easy task in our day any more. He would probably have preferred more time on Hashima island and Severine surviving, but overall I dare say he'd have enjoyed it.

[DaveBond21]

He would have been excited when Silva parted Bond's legs.

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[Guy Haines]

I wonder what Ian Fleming would have made of the villain being the end product of what seemed like a good idea of M's at the time? There was an interview with Dame Judi Dench around the time of Skyfall's release in which she said that her character had finally "had her come-uppence", and it is hard to disagree on this occasion.

Silva didn't have to be betrayed for what he got up to in Hong Kong. Like M he was doing, in fact, overdoing his job - but it happened, probably in the expectation that he'd do the "decent thing" and "top himself". Except that, of course, that didn't work either. Shopping Silva to the opposition was a decision which M probably filed away and forgot about - until it came back to haunt her.

"Too many people have died because of me" said M. Indeed. None of this means Silva was right to do what he did, far from it. But one could argue that M's decision was for short term advantage which resulted in an (admittedly unforeseeable) long term disaster.

[Dustin]

You could make a case that Dench's M is in fact the villain here, Silva merely her henchman, here creature. There is that moment when M - after meeting Silva face to face - tries to justify her decisions and Bond has for a moment a look on his face that clearly betrays how it could have been him being sold to whoever. Silva is very much a tragic figure in the tradition of Frankenstein's monster.

Edited by Dustin, 30 November 2012 - 07:41 PM.

[perdogg]

A pointless thread, and my apologies if this has already been discussed, but I was thinking the other day that, if Ian Fleming were a modern author writing a Bond novel today, "Skyfall" would have been the kind of story that he would have written. It pretty much distilled Bond back down to gadget-less and serious, despite the one-liners which (thankfully) didn't dip into the "Moore is less" gag bin.
And then I began to wonder what Mr. Fleming would have made of "Skyfall", with its strong notions of what it means to be British and the idea that the old methods are still needed in the modern world.
Just thinking out loud.

I think he would wonder why Bond is not interested in women, smoking, gambling, or drinking hard. I think he would wonder why M has Bond by the balls. Then he would get up to have a smoke and drink, maybe two, and then cry on how his creation was destroyed by talentless producers who ruined the reputation of the man who was intrusted in making Bond movies.

[Iceskater101]

Um I am not sure, I mean Fleming grew up in a very different time then the time we are in now so I think he would have problems with the movie just because the time are different now. I also think he wouldn't have liked Craig because he wasn't what he invisioned when writing the books. I think he would love all the jokes though in the film. So it's a tossup.

[Guy Haines]

You could make a case that Dench's M is in fact the villain here, Silva merely her henchman, here creature. There is that moment when M - after meeting Silva face to face - tries to justify her decisions and Bond has for a moment a look on his face that clearly betrays how it could have been him being sold to whoever. Silva is very much a tragic figure in the tradition of Frankenstein's monster.

Frankenstein's monster was an analogy I was going to use in my first post on this thread regarding Silva/Rodriguez, and I think you are right. And there's more to it. As Mallory points out, M could have made sure all those agents at risk after the computer disk was lost were withdrawn, but she didn't. As a result at least three MI6 agents died after they appeared online. As for the trade off - six agents for Silva - a computer genius is betrayed in return for six agents probably of no further use.

When the film was in pre-production over a year ago, we were told it would have a "shocking" storyline. A lot of us thought it meant a central character would be killed off, and so it proved. But who would have thought that the character concerned would have made some highly questionable decisions which led to the scenario resulting in her death? Yes, Mommy was very bad.

[The Shark]

I think he would wonder why Bond is not interested in women, smoking, gambling, or drinking hard.

The only one of those Bond doesn't do in SKYFALL is smoke.

[sharpshooter]

I saw this quote from Fleming, and I think Skyfall falls in line with it:

“My plots are fantastic, while being often based upon truth. They go wildly beyond the probable but not, I think, beyond the possible.”

Two examples straight off the bat:
Turning on the gas and blowing up part of MI6 via computer, would be very difficult, but technically not impossible.
Silva's abandoned island is a typical Bond villain lair. Outlandish location, acquired by fear and grounded in human behaviour.

[Golddragon71]

add to that, a disillusioned former agent coming back to exact his revenge on a system that he has felt had betrayed him........



WAITAMINUTE!!!!!!!!!!



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[Nicolas Suszczyk]

Well, I recall saying Fleming would be proud of CASINO ROYALE back in 2006, now I've got to think a bit.

 

I think the first we should take into account, as Iceskater said, is what would Fleming think of this society and hyper-globalizated world where you are able to send a 140 character message to a celebrity or a politician in the other extreme of the world only with your phone, or, as Q said, you can do more damage with your laptop in a pijama than in the field.

 

Fleming wrote his novels in the 50s, where nothing of this existed, where smoking and drinking was fashionable, and where to have contact with the outside world would take you a letter that would take you months to arrive and even more months to wait the reply. Still, I say Ian would be a bit shocked for the way Bond is acting now, but I'm not sure if he'd be disappointed. In fact there were here plenty reminicenses to the literary Bond here, like drinking pills to stay awake (Moonraker), running through the moors to save a woman (The Spy Who Loved Me), presumed dead with his obituary written (You Only Live Twice/The Man With The Golden Gun), a man who has a whole city for himself (Diamonds Are Forever), etc.

 

We should think first, as we said earlier, if Fleming would have liked his creation to be a period-piece character or an envolving character that could adapt his style into new eras (what EON did throughout the 50 years).