84 replies to this topic

[Darksideoftheschwartz]

I love the movie A View to a kill, but some people don't. Can you come up with 007 reasons why people dislike it?

[Kingdom Come]

No order:

1/ Poor screenplay.
2/ Fairly poorly directed.
3/ Protracted.
4/ Structure is weakened by far too many single scenes clogging up the pace.
5/ John Glen never knows when to cut on his own films.
6/ Standard production design.
7/ Golden Gate fight is massively unconvincing and leaves a negative aftertaste of the entire film.

(Sorry these reasons arn't terribly intellectual, but have just come off the top of my head).

[Loomis]

Off the top of me head and in no particular order:

- One of the "Bond books" ("Martinis, Girls and Guns", maybe) makes the point that Zorin and his team, the forces of evil, are young and stylish and dynamic, while the forces of good (Bond and co.) are old, conservative, past-it fuddy-duddies. (Mind you, this shouldn't necessarily be a reason to dislike the film - personally, I'm rather amused by this aspect.)

- Tanya Roberts is perceived as giving a performance so utterly wretched that she ought to be shot into outer space as punishment (all I can say is: She's. Not. That. Bad.).

- The film is rather dull and plodding, with no moments of real excitement. Again, I don't subscribe to this view, but I can see the point of view of those who do.

- It's a "silly" Bond outing (with too much weak so-called comic relief) in which there's a "serious" film struggling to get out. I believe there's a school of thought that says A VIEW TO A KILL would have worked much better as Dalton's first than as Moore's last.

- "California Girls". For some reason, this really annoys some people (who don't, strangely enough, tend to go beserk over such things as the LAWRENCE OF ARABIA music in THE SPY WHO LOVED ME).

- Too much time spent in America. Seems to be an issue chiefly for US fans, who'd prefer a more "exotic" location.

- Only Walken really makes much impact (appears to be a widely-held view).

But, as you've probably guessed, I like A VIEW TO A KILL, although I'd never say that it's one of the highlights of the series, exactly. There are probably lots of reasons why people don't like it, but these are the seven that occur to me first.

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

Off the top of me head and in no particular order:

- One of the "Bond books" ("Martinis, Girls and Guns", maybe) makes the point that Zorin and his team, the forces of evil, are young and stylish and dynamic, while the forces of good (Bond and co.) are old, conservative, past-it fuddy-duddies. (Mind you, this shouldn't necessarily be a reason to dislike the film - personally, I'm rather amused by this aspect.)

I don't mind the old Bond concept but that is definitely a problem for most people...Roger especially just looks bad. Personally, I think Roger is the only Bond who really went out right.

- Tanya Roberts is perceived as giving a performance so utterly wretched that she ought to be shot into outer space as punishment (all I can say is: She's. Not. That. Bad.).

Not that bad, no...but I'll still take the space option. We'll just put her in a rocket and fire away -

*gasp, squeal* That's incredibly dangerous! *starts screaming*

- Only Walken really makes much impact (appears to be a widely-held view).

Which I'd agree with...grandpa Roger does well as always but nobody else in the cast really stands out.



-The plot just doesn't seem all that sinister...cause a flood, great, who cares...economic disasters just aren't as scary as nuclear warheads or...uhm....sun...rays (the real Golden Gun *chuckle chuckle)

-That awful fight under the stables and how pathetically bad the chase up the eiffel tower is.

-Joe Lee, CIA...whatever the hell his name was...I didn't care for him, they should've just made it Felix.

-Grace Jones gives me nightmares.

[Loomis]

-Joe Lee, CIA...whatever the hell his name was...I didn't care for him, they should've just made it Felix.

Yeah. Odd that Felix makes just one appearance in the Moore era. Did he and Bond have a massive falling-out in 1973, not healing the rift until 1987?

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

Maybe that's why "Felix" sounded so annoyed with him in TLD...it would take them two years to make up for 15 of distance and secret animosity over putting Mrs Bell in intensive care.

[Mr Malcolm]

I wouldn't say I hated AVTAK, but it's definitely way down on my list, because:

- Tanya Roberts may not be that bad in terms of performance, but my God, can she SHRIEK or what?

- I heard that there actually were a bunch of stuntmen up on top of the Golden Gate bridge for the final fight. Why, then, does it look as though it takes place in the backlot of Pinewood?

- That credit sequence looked like it should have been in a spoof. The naked women dancing do so in a style I usually see more often in a club on Student Night.

- The film just feels kind of cheap, and not thrilling or sexy. Although I heard it got its budget cut, which would explain the first bit, it's no excuse for it not being either of the latter.

- Related to the final fight scene complaint above, said scene's over way too quickly.

- Why does Bond get the Order of Lenin? He doesn't do that much to help the Russians, surely?

And my top reason:

- The sex scenes just aren't sexy, they're wrong! I wouldn't have minded so much if the Bond girls had been a bit more mature (look at Octopussy; I thought that worked well enough), but as it is, it just feels a bit...sleazy. Witness May Day shuddering when she hops into bed with Rog! And that bit with Rog and the Russian bird in the hot-tub was just unforgiveably, cringeingly, cover-your-eyes-and-scream embarassing. IMHO.

I do like the overall plot (Zorin planning to flood Silicon Valley with a massive earthquake is suitably Bondian and fun), and Walken and Grace Jones are good to watch. The music and the title song were good too, but the rest of the film just isn't as much fun as it should have been.

[DLibrasnow]

Personally I love the movie....although the fight below the stables always makes me cringe.

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

Personally I love the movie....although the fight below the stables always makes me cringe.

I definitely don't hate it...but it's not high on my list.

[Blue07]

There are certain Bond opinions that are shouted louder than others - it's like chinese whispers, in the end it seems like a common held belief. 'Connery is the best' 'No film comes close to FRWL' 'Roger too jokey' 'Dalton too serious' 'OHMSS a masterpiece' 'AVTAK is crap.'

In the end it's all subjective. It's a shame for AVTAK because it's a decent film with a lot to recommend it. It reeks of the 80's and dear Rog was too old but other than that I don't see a great deal wrong with it.

Edited by Lappaman, 15 November 2005 - 03:41 PM.

[Loomis]

Maybe that's why "Felix" sounded so annoyed with him in TLD...it would take them two years to make up for 15 of distance and secret animosity over putting Mrs Bell in intensive care.

LOL!

[Harmsway]

I dislike it because I think it's boring. End of story.

[SecretAgentFan]

I definitely suffers from Roger looking to old and made up. However, it gets better with repeated viewing. And sometimes I think it is great fun.

[Bryce (003)]

I definitely suffers from Roger looking to old and made up. However, it gets better with repeated viewing. And sometimes I think it is great fun.

Agreed.

There are certain pros and cons, but I can't give you seven reasons why I don't like it.

OK - Stacey screamed too much - "James don't leave me!" - Yeah, that's what Bond does whenever a pretty girl is trapped somewhere - "Screw her! I'm outta here". Hell, even Christmas didn't go there when Bond left her in a missle cilo to chase down Renard.

and the aforementioned poorly staged fight in the microchip packing area with Tibbet - although it was kind of cool to see "Steed" and Bond delivering a few good punches.

The Fire Truck chase was a bit too comical, yet entertaining.

Other than that, I thought it was fine swan song for Roger and a pretty good Bond film, but a bit of a step down after FYEO and OP. I also wished they had left in the deleted bit that's on the SE-DVD of Bond being bailed out by M and collecting his effects in the Paris police station. That bit could've ONLY been done in a Roger Bond and should have stayed.

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

and the aforementioned poorly staged fight in the microchip packing area with Tibbet - although it was kind of cool to see "Steed" and Bond delivering a few good punches.

It was cool to see Steed and Bond period...but it was just a bad fight...

[Scorpion]

I thought Roger looked better than he did in Octopussy but unfortunately no amount of plastic surgery could hide the fact that it was a stunt "double" in the Parisian scenes...I mean it wasnt even close. It's if they could have cared less about taking the time to make the stuntman look even remotely similar to Roger. LOL!

Also, the fire truck chase was just way too comical and too long.

If they had "pruned" some of those scenes, 'View would have ranked higher.

Barry did a great job, however. His best work since OHMSS/DAF i.m.o.

Chris Walken was superb too. Very psychotic. I loved the look on his face as he gunned down his loyal employees in the Main Strike mine. Priceless.

Interesting story too, although it's taking most of it's constuction from the plot of Goldfinger a dozen years ealier. The same caper effectively surfaces in Brosnan's third outing if you notice.

[Streetworker]

I don't hate the movie; but it's definitely near the foot of my personal list. I find the best way not to dislike AVTAK actively is to leave long gaps between watching it. I promise I'm not being flippant. It's just that I find if I see it a long time after I last shoved in the DVD, it always seems better than I remembered it.

[Qwerty]

007 Reasons...[not necessarily my personal reasons]

• 1 - Stacey Sutton
• 2 - The stable fight sequence
• 3 - The fire truck chase
• 4 - Chuck Lee (gah!)
• 5 - Overall plot
• 6 - Roger Moore's age
• 7 - Oh I don't know, but there is bound to be something

A lesser favorite of mine, but I like A View To A Kill.

[Tarl_Cabot]

When Zorin does a check on Bond and the screen identifies him as "extremely dangerous"...well that's just hilarious in a Frank Drebban sort of way at this stage of Roger's era as Bond!

[Kara Milovy]

I'll offer 7 without looking at anyone else's response.

1) Worst. Bond girl. Ever.

2) Roger Moore's makeup is weird. His eyes bulge. He is wearing one of those "temporary facelift" devices, I think, that band the skin back, and he looks freakish. Very distracting.

3) The cutting between stuntwork and Moore is very poor. Because of his age, there are virtually no medium shots of action, just long shots and closeups. The look is thus very artificial and sloppy. None of the action is convincing.

4) Bad chases: The Paris car chase is one cliche after another. Goofy with no thrills. The fire engine chase is also goofy but not exciting, plus it makes me mad that Bond steals a fire engine from the scene of a fire; way to endanger life, James! And the steeplechase scene is stupid, senseless, and poorly directed.

5) Poor use of locations. San Francisco is an exotic and unusual city, but we see little of it. Paris is nothing but the Eiffel Tower. The best Bond locations give us local color, not just landmarks we can see in any travel brochure.

6) California Girls. 'nuff said.

7) The plot threads are never tied together. There is no real connection between the horse steriods, the silicon chips, and the Nazi eugenics program.

[Double-Oh-Zero]

Certainly not one of my favourites, but I can understand why many enjoy it. Still...

-probably the most far removed film from what Bond "should" be. I defy anyone to watch FRWL and AVTAK back-to-back and not sit there in disbelief, wondering if these two films are really part of the same series.

-how, um...how utterly campy it is?

-Bond makes quiche. No more, no less.

-has there ever really been a tackier opening credits sequence? I personally believe that Joel Schumacher lifted that idea for his Batman movies.

-a 60 year old Bond. Well, it was a fairly long boat ride from India to London at the end of Octopussy.

-did I already mention how campy it is?

-Frankly, I still haven't figured out how to meet one with a view to a kill, why the weekend's why, how an assassination stands still, or how a "lovers' stain" was even put into consideration as lyrics for a Bond song. That's filth, that is.

[Roger Moore's Bad Facelift]

7/ Golden Gate fight is massively unconvincing and leaves a negative aftertaste of the entire film.

I think that's one of the film's stronger points, actually. Thrilling climax.

Edited by Roger Moore's Bad Facelift, 15 November 2005 - 09:14 PM.

[Roebuck]

AVTAK is kind of like DAD,in that it became a game of two halves. Starts off strong and loses its way round about the middle. Picks up a bit during the scenes at Mainstrike but comes off the rails again before the end.

[Turn]

I think part of the problem with AVTAK is it wants to be a fun movie like the early Moores and also follow the trend of being a little more serious, probably taking into account Moore's age, like the previous two films. The screenplay tries to play both sides and becomes a real mess.

Examples:
-The precredits ski chase is exciting and suddenly you have California Girls camp it up.
-You have the frightening death of the Russian agent in the rotor blades followed by the scenes of the seduction of Pola followed by Gogol and her in the car with the wrong tape.
-You have the reality of Howe's death and Bond and Stacy's escape from the burning building followed by the drunk with the bottle and the ensuing comic firetruck chase where you get cowboy hats being kicked off, campers with sleeping people sheared off and destruction of police cars on the bridge that looks like an outtake from a Police Academy film.
-The scene of Zorin and Scarpine mowing down miners and the floating bodies also seem out of place. I think it's a great character touch, but it seems out of tone at this time. In TLD or any film after maybe, but not at that particular time in the series.

Same with some of the characters. The Stacy Sutton character tries to be presented as yet another strong, independent woman in the beginning and is reduced to screaming without the benefit of any of the sexpot characteristics that went along with some of the early Bond women. She's just there with no real defining characteristics, save for her screaming. I've heard people refer to her as the screaming Bond girl.

And Bond suffers too. Does anybody else think Moore seems very un-Moorelike for much of this film? One of his best scenes, the deleted Paris police station, hit the perfect Moore notes, and ended up being cut. It made more sense than his granddad falling asleep in the rocker after baking the quiche thing.

[Vanish]

I like A View to a Kill, but it certainly has its problems. Here are the "007" things I don't like about it:

1) Flat, uninspired direction
2) Arguably the worst pacing in any Bond film
3) Random "humorous" bits that aren't even remotely funny (the cab driver in Paris, the police chief in San Francisco)
4) Bond bakes a quiche.
5) The Firetruck chase is completely underwhelming and sacrfices suspense for cheap laughs.
6) Fight scenes aren't choreographed well at all (the fight below the stables is embarrassing, as the henchmen that Bond lays out can clearly be seen in the process of LYING DOWN on the conveyor belt).
7) The inclusion of The Beach Boys' "California Girls" mars an otherwise topnotch pretitle sequence.

That said, I do like the film - and I agree with Turn, in that AVTAK tries its hardest to have it both ways as both a serious and "fun-filled" Bond adventure, but it simply can't walk that line.

Edited by Vanish, 17 November 2005 - 05:48 AM.

[K1Bond007]

I'm going to steal a few of Kara's

001. "Worst Bond girl ever." Some how Stacy is a geologist? Please.

002. "The plot threads are never tied together. There is no real connection between the horse steriods, the silicon chips, and the Nazi eugenics program."

003. Poorly attempts at being another Goldfinger. It's so sad when you sit there and realise that certain events are happening almost identically. The film begins with the villain cheating at something then it goes into the Operation... Operation Grand Slam meet Operation Main Strike. "Well gentlemen lets blow something up to increase the profit of our stock" - "No I don't wanna" - "Ok see your wait out. Thanks for coming." - <killed>. Just overall a horrible screenplay. Dull. Not entertaining and some of the worst dialogue of any Bond film.

004. Old Roger Moore. Not to say it's that big of a deal, but the action scenes are all catered around Moore not being able to physically do the action. It's unconvincing and just looks silly.

005. The music IMHO is the worst of Barry's. The theme is fine and dandy, but the rest isn't that inspiring. It's amazing to watch this movie with attention to the music then watch The Living Daylights. Night and ... uhh Daylight. California Girls adds to the crap fest.

006. Silly humor that ...isn't funny. The firetruck sequence for example. This movie makes you question whether Bond is an Action Adventure film like The Living Daylights or if Bond is an Action Comedy like... Rush Hour.

007. So removed from the world of Bond it's pathetic. Moore should have bowed out with Octopussy. He'd be better off and hopefully the screenplay would have been changed majorly for the new actor - hopefully Dalton.

Harsh. I know. It's hard to say that any James Bond film is bad, but AVTAK comes really really close.

Edited by K1Bond007, 17 November 2005 - 07:53 AM.

[Kara Milovy]

I'll add one more. I can't stand the way that Bond treats Tibbet. The "funny" picking on him isn't funny, it's irritating and a little mean. It just grates on my nerves. McNee is such a coupe for the film and he's wasted.

[Mr. Larsen]

I like it but its still not the best.. ;b

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

I'll add one more. I can't stand the way that Bond treats Tibbet. The "funny" picking on him isn't funny, it's irritating and a little mean. It just grates on my nerves. McNee is such a coupe for the film and he's wasted.

I always noticed that...Roger really does pick on him and just for the hell of it.

Then he dies.

[Qwerty]

I'll add one more. I can't stand the way that Bond treats Tibbet. The "funny" picking on him isn't funny, it's irritating and a little mean. It just grates on my nerves. McNee is such a coupe for the film and he's wasted.

I always noticed that...Roger really does pick on him and just for the hell of it.

Then he dies.

In a way, he's the sacrificial lamb - although that role moreso is Chuck Lee's - one of the most bland and uninteresting allies in the series.