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Brosnan's thoughts on SPECTRE


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#61 byline

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 11:40 PM

No SPECTRE is better than GE. It aged badly.

 

Natalya, even then, was the kind of girl that get on the nerves. I was waiting for Bond to punch her.

 

The scene where she says her name to get out of the base and the computer doesn't work is bad, as is Boris I am Invincible!

 

There's not one character in SPECTRE as stupid and as unbearable as Boris. Couldn't even cheer when he died so stupid it was.

 

That dumb idiot also shakes his computer screen to get his computer to work, and it's a PC so he should shake the computer main body, not the screen which is separate. Bloody idiot.

Yup, I agree with most of this. Not the punching part, of course. But Natalya did work my nerves. And then the other extreme, Psycho-Kitty, was way too over-the-top. Don't get me wrong, there are parts of GoldenEye that I like. I thought it was a fun movie for its time, a great reentry for the Bond series. But I'm in complete agreement with all who note that it hasn't aged well. Brosnan's films suffer the same fate as many of Moore's, and a few of Connery's. The films that age better (and this is true, in general) are more stylish than fashionable. Which is not to say that none of Craig's films cater to current fashion; they do. But I think it's more muted.



#62 glidrose

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 11:42 PM

I like Brosnan, he's my #3 Bond very close behind Craig. I don't mind his comments. I don't think anybody should. Despite that and my many misgivings about Spectre, I think it's better than at least two and probably three of Brosnan's Bond flicks. Only TND rates higher.

Mind you, the failings of two-and-a-half of Brosnan's films (GE, TWINE, and the 2nd half of DAD) cannot be blamed on Brosnan.

#63 sharpshooter

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 11:16 AM

Mind you, the failings of two-and-a-half of Brosnan's films (GE, TWINE, and the 2nd half of DAD) cannot be blamed on Brosnan.

 

I agree. I prefer other Bonds, namely Connery, Moore and Craig. But I think the negativity towards Brosnan is overstated at times. He's his own harshest critic, but nonetheless I think he genuinely honoured the character. And at the time people were enjoying the ride. I rate GE and TND as Bond films. They're a solid one, two punch. I can also enjoy DAD, particularly the great first half. TWINE was his weakest. 



#64 SecretAgentFan

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 11:30 AM

It´s all a matter of perspective, isn´t it?  (Sorry, couldn´t resist.)

 

But seriously: personally liking an actor might easily lead one to consider him a good actor while disliking an actor might do the opposite.

 

In both cases, it´s not a reliable judgement.

 

Personally, I do like Brosnan as an actor very much.  He definitely has charisma and the camera loves him.  He also has a bigger range than many want to accept.  That resentment of Brosnan might be because of his good looks and because he sometimes relies too much on his bag of tricks.  But every actor does that.  Yes, even - SHOCK!!!! - Daniel Craig.



#65 Orion

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 03:35 PM

It´s all a matter of perspective, isn´t it?  (Sorry, couldn´t resist.)

 

But seriously: personally liking an actor might easily lead one to consider him a good actor while disliking an actor might do the opposite.

 

In both cases, it´s not a reliable judgement.

 

Personally, I do like Brosnan as an actor very much.  He definitely has charisma and the camera loves him.  He also has a bigger range than many want to accept.  That resentment of Brosnan might be because of his good looks and because he sometimes relies too much on his bag of tricks.  But every actor does that.  Yes, even - SHOCK!!!! - Daniel Craig.

This is very true. Not helped that many a casting director goes for the actor's (as you quite accurately put it) bag of tricks rather than their actual acting range, which quickly leads to people going "oh he/she just plays the same role over and over" when in actuality its more they are hired specifically to do the same thing - for example Will Smith who was just hired to play his Bad Boys character constantly until Michael Mann cast him in Ali.



#66 Professor Pi

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 03:51 PM

Eh, not much here IMHO, he's always been good for a poisonous comment or three. I was pissed at Brosnan's trashing his own films while he was still in the role, had a bad habit of bad-mouthing his previous film while promoting the new one, not very gracious at all IMO.

 

To be fair, Brosnan never said he'd rather slit his wrists than do another one.



#67 blueman

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 06:18 PM

Was he saying that about how bad the film turned out? Or about how hard it is to make one?

Brosnan said far worse things about the Bond films he starred in than Craig's, oddly enough. And no, he's not that great of an actor, his take on Bond varied from scene to scene, which he freely admitted.

#68 tdalton

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 06:23 PM

To be fair, Brosnan never said he'd rather slit his wrists than do another one.


Indeed he didn't. Another reason why the criticism of Brosnan in this thread has gone completely overboard, especially when you consider the lengths people will go in order to defend much, much worse comments made by Craig.

#69 Orion

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 06:39 PM

 

To be fair, Brosnan never said he'd rather slit his wrists than do another one.


Indeed he didn't. Another reason why the criticism of Brosnan in this thread has gone completely overboard, especially when you consider the lengths people will go in order to defend much, much worse comments made by Craig.

 

Brosnan is (really unfairly) the one it's fair to criticize, having at some point taken the dubious title from Lazenby. Both unfair. Bond films, and their actors, were cast for the time, Brosnan's performance, and his four films, were what the Bond films needed to be for the audience in mid to late nineties (before someone complains about DIe Another Day - xxx was the other successful spy movie that year, and it makes DAD look like From Russia With love, Bourne Identity didn't find an audience till it's dvd release) I imagine Craig will have a similar backlash in about a decade when we are well into his successors run. Taste's change, and it is unfair to judge what came before through those eyes.



#70 tdalton

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 06:43 PM

I'm not talking about judging their films. The quality of their films is irrelevant to the discussion here. Brosnan simply states that the story for SPECTRE was a bit on the weak side (while lavishing praise on Craig), and is viciously attacked for such comments, while Craig stated that he'd rather slit his wrists than play Bond again and is praised and defended for saying so. That's just not right.

#71 Orion

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 07:03 PM

I'm not talking about judging their films. The quality of their films is irrelevant to the discussion here. Brosnan simply states that the story for SPECTRE was a bit on the weak side (while lavishing praise on Craig), and is viciously attacked for such comments, while Craig stated that he'd rather slit his wrists than play Bond again and is praised and defended for saying so. That's just not right.

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear as I went ludicrously off point, I meant that Brosnan's present unpopularity as a Bond makes him, for some people, fair game in over the top criticism of the man generally when he offers an opinion, the same sort of treatment that used to be reserved for Lazenby. The line seems to somehow blur between not liking a man's performance as an actor and disliking the actual person. Craig get's given benefit of the doubt because of a fondness for his work whilst Brosnan is not because of there is less fondness for the work. Basically it's a variation of The Halo Effect. Ludicrously unfair as blatantly the same thing has happened, the actor has been asked a pointed question and then the journalist has taken out the sentence that's going to serve as the best headline/Click bait regardless of the context of what was said.



#72 tdalton

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 07:09 PM

Gotcha. I misread your initial comments. :)

I do agree with that point. I will admit, I've done my fair share of Brosnan-bashing over the years. I like him as an actor, just not necessarily as Bond.

I think it's pretty clear cut that Brosnan doesn't deserve this kind (or any, for that matter) of backlash for very mild comments that mirror what everyone else has already said about the film. They certainly don't rise to anywhere near the level of Craig saying he'd rather slash his wrists, a disgustingly tone-deaf comment if there ever was one, than be paid millions of dollars to play make-believe again.

#73 Hockey Mask

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 02:26 AM

I'm not talking about judging their films. The quality of their films is irrelevant to the discussion here. Brosnan simply states that the story for SPECTRE was a bit on the weak side (while lavishing praise on Craig), and is viciously attacked for such comments, while Craig stated that he'd rather slit his wrists than play Bond again and is praised and defended for saying so. That's just not right.


If it matters I lashed out at Brosnan here and one of the first ones to do the same about Craig. Go look.

#74 Professor Pi

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 03:19 PM

Thanks, tdalton, for understanding my point and carrying on the discussion.  I felt both actors' comments were taken out of context to be sensationalized.  Brosnan made the Bond franchise commericially viable again in a way that Dalton's didn't.  Craig's films elevated Bond artistically in a way that Brosnan couldn't.  Both were vital to the Bond franchise during key points in time.



#75 byline

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 03:20 PM

Very good points, Professor Pi. I agree!



#76 tdalton

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 03:38 PM

Thanks, tdalton, for understanding my point and carrying on the discussion.  I felt both actors' comments were taken out of context to be sensationalized.  Brosnan made the Bond franchise commericially viable again in a way that Dalton's didn't.  Craig's films elevated Bond artistically in a way that Brosnan couldn't.  Both were vital to the Bond franchise during key points in time.


While I would agree that it's possible that Craig's comments were taken out of context to the point of being sensationalized by the media, I do think that there is a crucial difference between the two. Craig was essentially on EON's time, doing promotion for SPECTRE, when he made the comments. Regardless of how they were meant to be taken, it's rather unprofessional to make such a comment while you're on the clock for your employer.

Brosnan, on the other hand, is now just a private citizen, albeit one who has played the part himself. His comments are much less ridiculous than Craig's, and I would say barely even qualify as criticisms of the film (and certainly milder criticisms than those levied by people on the internet), yet he's dragged through the mud while everyone bends over backwards to defend Craig's much worse comments.

#77 blueman

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 04:54 PM

If he's just commenting about how tough to film a Bond is, we've been hearing that sense Connery.  I don't read into it that he slagged his own film, unlike Brosnan when he was in the role.  Brosnan has created his own context with this, over many decades, not seeing he (or his defenders) have a leg to stand on.



#78 201050

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Posted 28 November 2015 - 02:34 PM

His "It’s neither Bond nor Bourne. Am I in a Bond movie? Not in a Bond movie?” comment is a bit dickish, but more than that it's just lazy. That comparison was made frequently seven years ago and rightly so.

Quantum is one of only two Bond films I don't own and only saw once (DAD is the other). I disliked the shaky-cam two-images-a-second editing that it clearly borrowed from the second two Bourne films.

However, since then we've had two films that are 100% Bond. We have Moneypenny and Q restored and better than ever. We have the return of a classic villain. Fantastic cinematography, fantastic score, fantastic female lead, a realistic return to gadgets and a touch of humor.

Skyfall and Spectre are the two Bond films I've been waiting on for decades. To bring up the Bourne films when discussing them is lazy.

Edited by 201050, 28 November 2015 - 03:19 PM.


#79 blueman

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Posted 28 November 2015 - 07:55 PM

Considering the box office, I guess fans/general public know it's a Bond film even if Brozzer is in the dark about it, lol.  Also, considering Brosnan's films made bank, perhaps exactly what Bond is is being narrowly defined?  EON has done a very good job with the public post-the 80s, if some of us grumble about this or that (although one could say that about even LTK, which is the #10 grossing Bond film worldwide adjusted for inflation...).

 

Bond is very very wide.



#80 FlemingBond

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 03:33 PM

this is still a topic?



#81 Single-O-Seven

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 05:02 PM

this is still a topic?


Only until Connery or Lazenby or Moore or Dalton slam it. Then we can move on.