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A way around the "Austin Powers" problem?


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#1 Everything or nothing

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 07:23 AM

I seem to be in the minority but I find the whole "stepbrother" plot "twist" too ridiculous even for a Bond film. So much so that I'm afraid it fundamentally damages the whole film for me. I was therefore going to just ignore that whole story line (much like the same way we can ignore Bond previously meeting Blofeld in YOLT when watching OHMSS). I think this actually improves my enjoyment of Spectre as it would explain why the storyline has no plot implications (eg Bond does not react when told his "father figure" was murdered and he even uses the name Blofeld in the finale when logically he should call him Franz  - if only to piss him off).

 

However I think it may just be possible for us to take ther view that Blofeld is not Franz and was just lying as part of the whole torture process in order to get to Bond. Admittedly I have only seen the film once so this could all fall to pieces But Bond only initially sees Franz in shadow and do we actually see any evidence that Blofeld is Franz (other than the photo of course)? Is it concievable that Blofeld found out about Bond's investigations into the death/faked-death of Franz through his spying on MI6, put two and two together, and used this information to lie about being Franz in order to try to really get to Bond. In fact this could extended to cover the whole "author of all your misfortunes": Blofeld only tells Bond this, we never see any evidence.

 

I know this all sounds a bit silly but surely it is no more ridiculous than asking us to believe that an annoymous ski instructor was a father figure to the world's best hero and the world's worst bad guy? Anyway it works better for me as I think the actual plot point diminishes Blofeld by making him a madman with Daddy issues.



#2 Guy Haines

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 09:33 AM

Thinking about it - what you suggest is possible. Blofeld does after all have access to information, has people everywhere, must be aware after nine years that the author of all SPECTRE's pain has been James Bond, may bear a passing resemblance to Oberhauser and gathers together information about Bond's past to play on that, right down to the photograph in the room

But there's nothing in the story to suggest Blofeld wasn't at one time Franz Oberhauser.

That said, I was surprised how restrained the film was on this point. Bond asks Moneypenny to search for stuff about Oberhauser before and after he died. Q finds a connection between Oberhauser and other SPECTRE personnel. Oberhauser plays on Bond's past and the lives lost because of him and claims credit for them. But the familial link - mentoned in passing, brushed aside. Even Bond's reaction to Oberhauser's change of name - "catchy" - is in passing. By the time we are back in London the villain is referred to more than once only as Ernst Stavro Blofeld or just Blofeld. It's as if Bond also regards the young man he knew as a youth as dead and buried too.

Or it could just be the scriptwriters who may have over egged the family link pudding on first draft - but couldn't, for whatever reason, drop the Bond/Oberhauser/Blofeld plot point - decided to make as little use of it as they had to. Which leaves the audience to read into it what they will.

#3 Guy Haines

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 10:08 AM

I've just had a further thought.

Lets look ahead to a future Bond film - number 25 or whatever - in which Blofeld features, Bond takes him on and kills him, or Blofeld disappears, as he used to do in the 1960s.

And at some point in the movie - probably near the end - someone on Bond's side - Moneypenny, Q? - does some further digging and discovers that, yes, the whole "Franz Oberhauser" thing has been an elaborate charade. That Blofeld has in fact spent years investigating Bond's background - an inversion of what happened in OHMSS in which Bond pretends to investigate Blofeld's. And ESB comes across the Oberhausers and concocts the story that Franz killed dad and now calls himself Blofeld - when in fact both died for real and Blofeld is using the knowledge to get back at Bond, along with everything else, as psychological warfare on an adversary of SPECTRE. That the "personal" angle isn't about Bond as a "cuckoo" in the Oberhauser nest, but that he interfered with Blofeld's world post 2006.

And having done this digging, we discover that in fact Blofeld has no family link with the Oberhausers whatsoever, but remains, to coin a phrase an "international man of mystery" ;-)

Far fetched? Certainly. But as far fetched as Bond and Blofeld being linked by Hannes Oberhauser?

#4 bond_azoozbond

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 10:45 AM

When the brother connection first mentioned before the release of SPECTRE, I was thinking this will never happen in a bond movie. I mean its not Marvel or DC character .. Its bond and we never had his villain be related to him in any of the previous movies.

I saw SPECTRE twice and I didnt read any script leaks at all since December, My understanding when I saw it the first time is that Blofeld doesn't relate to bond , he lied to him and he used the Oberhauser story as a part of others : Vesper death , Quantum , M's death .. etc .

After seeing the movie I started to dig over all spoilers and the script leaks , and then went to watch SPECTRE one more time ..
I can see its not clear .. I guess people who kept reading the scripts had more information that could be tweaked and changed..

#5 SecretAgentFan

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 11:08 AM

I've just had a further thought.

Lets look ahead to a future Bond film - number 25 or whatever - in which Blofeld features, Bond takes him on and kills him, or Blofeld disappears, as he used to do in the 1960s.

And at some point in the movie - probably near the end - someone on Bond's side - Moneypenny, Q? - does some further digging and discovers that, yes, the whole "Franz Oberhauser" thing has been an elaborate charade. That Blofeld has in fact spent years investigating Bond's background - an inversion of what happened in OHMSS in which Bond pretends to investigate Blofeld's. And ESB comes across the Oberhausers and concocts the story that Franz killed dad and now calls himself Blofeld - when in fact both died for real and Blofeld is using the knowledge to get back at Bond, along with everything else, as psychological warfare on an adversary of SPECTRE. That the "personal" angle isn't about Bond as a "cuckoo" in the Oberhauser nest, but that he interfered with Blofeld's world post 2006.

And having done this digging, we discover that in fact Blofeld has no family link with the Oberhausers whatsoever, but remains, to coin a phrase an "international man of mystery" ;-)

Far fetched? Certainly. But as far fetched as Bond and Blofeld being linked by Hannes Oberhauser?

 

Now that it has been done it would be weird, IMO, to undo it.

 

The Blofeld of the Craig era was Franz Oberhauser.  CraigBond is just always personally involved with everything.



#6 Mr Teddy Bear

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 11:47 AM

 

I've just had a further thought.

Lets look ahead to a future Bond film - number 25 or whatever - in which Blofeld features, Bond takes him on and kills him, or Blofeld disappears, as he used to do in the 1960s.

And at some point in the movie - probably near the end - someone on Bond's side - Moneypenny, Q? - does some further digging and discovers that, yes, the whole "Franz Oberhauser" thing has been an elaborate charade. That Blofeld has in fact spent years investigating Bond's background - an inversion of what happened in OHMSS in which Bond pretends to investigate Blofeld's. And ESB comes across the Oberhausers and concocts the story that Franz killed dad and now calls himself Blofeld - when in fact both died for real and Blofeld is using the knowledge to get back at Bond, along with everything else, as psychological warfare on an adversary of SPECTRE. That the "personal" angle isn't about Bond as a "cuckoo" in the Oberhauser nest, but that he interfered with Blofeld's world post 2006.

And having done this digging, we discover that in fact Blofeld has no family link with the Oberhausers whatsoever, but remains, to coin a phrase an "international man of mystery" ;-)

Far fetched? Certainly. But as far fetched as Bond and Blofeld being linked by Hannes Oberhauser?

 

Now that it has been done it would be weird, IMO, to undo it.

 

The Blofeld of the Craig era was Franz Oberhauser.  CraigBond is just always personally involved with everything.

 

 

Agreed. And as noted hardly any time was spent on this angle to the point where it could simply be ignored in the future. Any attempt at elaborately explaining it away would only bring the spotlight back to something that is fairly forgettable in SPECTRE.



#7 Professor Pi

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 11:55 AM

I think in the early draft, Franz Oberhauser was the half-brother villain on his own.  But when they got the rights to the character, 'Blofeld' was shoe horned into the pre-existing storyline.  It never quite worked, and indeed, the plot is better without that angle.  It's enough that Bond interfered with Blofeld's plans, and Blofeld destroyed his world as a plot point.  It would have worked as SPECTRE's plan merely to lure Bond in to assassinate him, ala From Russia with Love.  "And I thought you came here to die."

 

On the other hand, as its box office is still a success, this shows how "spoof proof" Bond is.  Not only can EON do a Home Alone finale and have no critics call them on it, they can remake an Austin Powers plot line with a straight face and get away with it, at least at the box office. 

 

This movie had serious script problems, as evidenced by the producers bringing in Purvis and Wade in 2013 after John Logan submitted it, and the leaks of the two scripts in 2014.  Too many cooks in the kitchen, but by then, they were locked into a production schedule and release date.



#8 Guy Haines

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 12:15 PM

The idea that Blofeld isn't really Oberhauser I suggested as a way out if enough fans and audiences found the link between Bond and ESB too unbelievable to accept. But as a plot point it hasn't sent many fans reeling, probably because its been done in such an off hand way that it doesn't really detract from the main thrust of the movie. It' something that could be done in a future film if the writers were so minded, but as I mentioned earlier, Bond now regards Oberhauser as Blofeld and treats the previous character as if he really is dead. Probably his way of handling it - and quite unlike the "how could you?" attitude Pierce Brosnan's Bond took when Alec Trevelyan, 006 was revealed to be not only very much alive but had turned to the dark side - again because of family reasons - in GE. But then again, 006 and 007 were supposedly best mates - for all we know, James and Franz may have loathed each other from the outset, hence Bond not much caring if Franz is now Ernst.

#9 RMc2

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:52 PM

Monica Bellucci should have been Blofeld. After Bond left her alive, and when we saw that cat, I genuinely expected her to walk in and pick it up, revealing her true identity. Franz Oberhauser would then have remained the villain (or rather, a henchman) and the personal connection to Bond wouldn't be quite so karmic.

 

But then that would cause all kinds of other headaches, as to why Lucia slept with Bond and directed him towards the Rome meeting.

 

Meh, never mind.



#10 FlemingBond

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 03:21 PM

i wish he wasn't .I'd love to have the next movie pick up with Franz in jail and the 'real' Blofeld sends an assassin  to kill him for failing. 



#11 DavidSomerset

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Posted 18 November 2015 - 12:31 AM

Would you want to hire a double Oscar Winner and make him a henchman? I am really looking forward to Waltz scream "Kill. Bond. Now" in the next movie. The next one should also have Siamese fighting fish. With lasers.



#12 DaveBond21

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Posted 18 November 2015 - 01:18 AM

I don't think it matters. I just sit back and enjoy the movie.



#13 Everything or nothing

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Posted 18 November 2015 - 02:29 AM

Thanks. Some great points. On balance I think the easiest way out of this mess is just to never mention this again (I the same way that no-one in OHMSS mentions that Bond has already come face to face with ESB in YOLT).

 

I was hoping that in the finale the "real" Blofeld would appear. I think the story should have had Mr White as ESB ("white" after the cat perhaps?). It certainly would have made the "author of all your misfortunes" more plausible.

 

Otherwise they should have had Max von Sydow!