42 replies to this topic

[Brannigan]

I recently downloaded the original B/W episodes of the Saint. (I did this because here in the States less than half of them are on DVD. The only complete set can be found in Region 2 dvd). As I'm watching the show (right now through the first part of Season 1), I have to say this is a good show. For a sixties British TV show the quality of the writing, filming and acting is pretty high. I find it interesting that in the first 7 episodes I've watched only 1 has been set in England (the first episode). The rest have been set in various parts of Europe and New York (in a foreshadowing moment, the Saint leaves New York on Pan Am and the terminal building is shown. 11 years later Moore as Bond will be seen in front of this building arriving in New York in LALD). Speaking of Moore, he is already Bond IMO in this series. From the one-liners to the charm, all of the elements that would make Roger Moore Bond are present. Finally the guest stars: I think I have at least 20 persons from the Saint that appeared in Bond at one time from Honor Blackman, Shirley Eaton and Walter Gottell, to actors playing lesser known Bond Characters (Peter Brown, Geoffrey Keene, and Shane Rimmer, to name a few).
So what are your thoughts on one what was one of the longest running English Shows?

[David_M]

Agreed on all points: a fine show, generally well written with many great performances, and Roger has indeed already perfected his routine at this early stage. If anything, he's even tougher here than as Bond. I love the way he threatens the baddie in "The Careful Terrorist," then sets him up to unwittingly explode himself at the end (even though the fun is marred by Templar begging him not to do it, no doubt a concession demanded by TV morality). Another standout is Templar's fight with a thug in his hotel room in "The Benevolent Burglary," which includes Roger holding a guy upside down by the legs and banging his head on the floor! Proof that Rog could do great fight scenes, even if they weren't always the greatest in his Bond outings.

Also agree it's a shame they haven't given us more B/W episodes here in the States. I'm curious to know where you downloaded them. I'd like to follow suit, assuming it's not going to result in a cadre of lawyers beating down my door.

[jaguar007]

Much of this type of discussion has been going on in this thread on The Saint

http://debrief.comma...2976-the-saint/

[Brannigan]

I started this one because the other thread looked like it was a discussion of the possible new movie and the Val Kilmer disaster. I was focusing this thread on the Moore Series.

[Brian Flagg]

I started this one because the other thread looked like it was a discussion of the possible new movie and the Val Kilmer disaster. I was focusing this thread on the Moore Series.

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

Anyway, I liked the few that what I did see--a lot! Some of the episodes that stand out are The Queen's Ransom and Interlude in Venice , the latter having that Bond connection with guest Lois Maxwell.

The one I really need to see is the dry run for The Persuaders!, The Ex-King of Diamonds, which has Rog teamed up with Stuart Damon. I believe both shows use the same font for episode titles and cast credits, too. Does anyone know the name of that font?

[Byron]

Agreed on all points: a fine show, generally well written with many great performances, and Roger has indeed already perfected his routine at this early stage. If anything, he's even tougher here than as Bond. I love the way he threatens the baddie in "The Careful Terrorist," then sets him up to unwittingly explode himself at the end (even though the fun is marred by Templar begging him not to do it, no doubt a concession demanded by TV morality). Another standout is Templar's fight with a thug in his hotel room in "The Benevolent Burglary," which includes Roger holding a guy upside down by the legs and banging his head on the floor! Proof that Rog could do great fight scenes, even if they weren't always the greatest in his Bond outings.

Also agree it's a shame they haven't given us more B/W episodes here in the States. I'm curious to know where you downloaded them. I'd like to follow suit, assuming it's not going to result in a cadre of lawyers beating down my door.

I also agree with your points David and Brannigan. They don't make great shows like The Saint anymore. Roger seems very Bondlike and much tougher in the Saint than in his 007 films. Arrow of God is another episode with lots of Bond alumni including the great Anthony Dawson!

If you lads are willing to fork out a few pound then i suggest the Network TV Complete Black & White series of the Saint DVD set, available on Amazon.co.uk

I got sick of watching the same episodes out of order on cable so i got the dvd set. Every disc has 4 episodes on it.

Although Umbrella in Australia also released a set, i could not find it for sale anywhere.

[Brannigan]

I just watched the Pearls of Peace and one of the characters is blind. He rows a boat out to sea where his girlfriend dives for pearls. Sound like a familiar story? This was from 1962...

[Kronsteen]

I found the complete box set of the series in a shop for 200 swedish Kronas (about 30 dollars or 18 pounds) and I just had to buy it, of course!
So I'm currently half way through the second season, and my god it takes time. But it's a very fine show so it's definately worth the time. Roger Moore is excellent, the plots are mostly well-written and there are some really good co-stars.

[Joe Bond]

I started this one because the other thread looked like it was a discussion of the possible new movie and the Val Kilmer disaster. I was focusing this thread on the Moore Series.

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

Anyway, I liked the few that what I did see--a lot! Some of the episodes that stand out are The Queen's Ransom and Interlude in Venice , the latter having that Bond connection with guest Lois Maxwell.

The one I really need to see is the dry run for The Persuaders!, The Ex-King of Diamonds, which has Rog teamed up with Stuart Damon. I believe both shows use the same font for episode titles and cast credits, too. Does anyone know the name of that font?

I believe William Sylvester was also in the Interlude to Venice episode. Sylvester had a bit part in YOLT as well as playing Dr. Heywood Floyd in 2001: A Space Odyssey.

[David_M]

I believe William Sylvester was also in the Interlude to Venice episode. Sylvester had a bit part in YOLT as well as playing Dr. Heywood Floyd in 2001: A Space Odyssey.

The episode also features Paul Stassino, who played Francois Derval and his nefarious double in "Thunderball" (making him, if I'm not mistaken, the only actor to die twice in a single Bond film!).

[DR76]

Agreed on all points: a fine show, generally well written with many great performances, and Roger has indeed already perfected his routine at this early stage. If anything, he's even tougher here than as Bond. I love the way he threatens the baddie in "The Careful Terrorist," then sets him up to unwittingly explode himself at the end (even though the fun is marred by Templar begging him not to do it, no doubt a concession demanded by TV morality). Another standout is Templar's fight with a thug in his hotel room in "The Benevolent Burglary," which includes Roger holding a guy upside down by the legs and banging his head on the floor! Proof that Rog could do great fight scenes, even if they weren't always the greatest in his Bond outings.

Also agree it's a shame they haven't given us more B/W episodes here in the States. I'm curious to know where you downloaded them. I'd like to follow suit, assuming it's not going to result in a cadre of lawyers beating down my door.

In a biography about Roger Moore, the author claimed that he thought Moore's Templar was a little more ruthless and cold-blooded than his Bond. What do you think?

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

The earlier B/W episodes of "THE SAINT" were also aired in the U.S. I do recall seeing them either in the late 1980s or early 1990s.

[jaguar007]

In a biography about Roger Moore, the author claimed that he thought Moore's Templar was a little more ruthless and cold-blooded than his Bond. What do you think?

Absolutely! I wish Moore had portrayed Bond a little closer to the earlier Saint episodes. Moore is not my favorite Bond, but The Saint is my all time favorite TV show. Hell, I named my son Simon after him, and I have this little guy sitting in the garage (note the license plate).

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[Capsule in Space]

Absolutely! I wish Moore had portrayed Bond a little closer to the earlier Saint episodes. Moore is not my favorite Bond, but The Saint is my all time favorite TV show. Hell, I named my son Simon after him, and I have this little guy sitting in the garage (note the license plate).

Hey we kind of agree on something again! Moore is my favorite Bond, but I think his performances in Live and Let Die and The Man with the Golden Gun would have been better if Guy Hamilton had allowed Sir Roger to unleash the "Simon Templar" within him.

I wish The Saint was played more in the U.S. When Garth Ancier took over at BBC America he cut out re-runs of The Saint, The Avengers, The Persuaders!, etc. and I really wish he hadn't done that!

I also think Simon is a great name.

Oh and nice car!

[Guy Haines]

I watch colour episodes of The Saint on ITV 4 of a morning, before I toddle off to work, and I've been watching my DVD boxed set of The Saint (given the current state of TV these days - Celebrity Big Brother, for God's sake! -, my DVD player is getting a lot of use!)

I'm thoroughly enjoying watching this series from my earliest days all over again. Interesting to see some of the names who later became famous - even very famous in Hollywood - in supporting roles in the series. One example - Donald Sutherland appeared in one of the colour episodes as a jailbird who escapes and meets an unfortunate end. And the actors in recycled roles - the late David Bauer (DAF's Morton Slumber) must have been in every other episode in the early days, or it seemed like it, and I've watched a black and white episode tonight in which TB's Paul Stassino played one of the villains (the head villain being played by Douglas Wilmer, who appeared in OP, and it also featured Geoffrey Palmer - TND's Admiral Roebuck - playing a security guard with a cockney accent. I sat there and thought "That's not Judi Dench's husband in "Time Goes By", is it? With that accent?" It was!)

The Saint was a showcase for quite a few British and Commonwealth actors in prime time TV, and future film directors such as Peter Yates (of "Bullitt" fame - he directed one of the episodes I watched this evening.) And best of all of course it had Roger Moore!

Well, that's my two penneth. Back to the DVD and nostalgia time!

[jaguar007]

We cannot forget the episode (I think "Luella" off the top of my head), where David Hedison was in it. THere was a scene where Templar secretly told a lady that he was James Bond and his friend (Hedison) was his friend from the FBI. Bit of prophesy perhaps?

[David_M]

In a biography about Roger Moore, the author claimed that he thought Moore's Templar was a little more ruthless and cold-blooded than his Bond. What do you think?

Yes and no. On the whole, I'd say Templar is more of a tough guy in the "private eye" mold, and more "itching to fight." Roger's Bond is like an older Templar; just as cool under pressure, sophisticated and quick-witted, but not so hard-boiled. On the other hand, Roger's Saint was made for TV, so you didn't get stuff as brutal as Bond brushing away Sandor to his death, or shooting an unarmed Stromberg four times (the first couple in the family jewels!).

There's not much of a body count for Templar; usually he kills in self-defense or his attackers manage to do themselves in. Also, unlike Bond the whole reason Simon's usually involved in a dangerous situation is because he chose to be; theoretically he's doing it out of a sense of justice, but often it seems he's just helping strangers out of a jam, which is a different matter entirely from dealing death based on orders from above; Templar is more of a "do-gooder," really.

So in terms of "ruthless," I'd give the edge to Bond, who kills pretty remorselessly, and often. But in terms of toughness, I'd give the edge to Templar, who doesn't take crap from anyone.

[St Louis]

Bond has his orders, but the Saint takes orders from nobody - which is one reason why I'll always prefer the Saint...

[jaguar007]

So in terms of "ruthless," I'd give the edge to Bond, who kills pretty remorselessly, and often. But in terms of toughness, I'd give the edge to Templar, who doesn't take crap from anyone.

I'll agree with this. As Templar, Moore would walk into a room and could stand up to anyone. As Bond he never really conveyed that alpha toughness.

[Ernst Stavro Blofeld Jr.]

If anyone in the US has RTV (retro tv) then you can watch b&w saint episodes. I watch them every night at 10 and its wonderful. Though I know the channel airings differ depending on one's location.

[Brian Flagg]

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

The earlier B/W episodes of "THE SAINT" were also aired in the U.S. I do recall seeing them either in the late 1980s or early 1990s.

I thought so, but wasn't sure. Perhaps it was on A&E, around the same time they aired the monochrome episodes of The Avengers. My grandfather was a big fan of The Saint and being the old codger that he was, always considered Rog Simon Templar rather than James Bond.

[Brisco]

In a biography about Roger Moore, the author claimed that he thought Moore's Templar was a little more ruthless and cold-blooded than his Bond. What do you think?

Absolutely! I wish Moore had portrayed Bond a little closer to the earlier Saint episodes. Moore is not my favorite Bond, but The Saint is my all time favorite TV show. Hell, I named my son Simon after him, and I have this little guy sitting in the garage (note the license plate).

Awesome car and license plate, Jaguar! (Though for some reason I'd figured you for a Jag man....)

[jaguar007]

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

The earlier B/W episodes of "THE SAINT" were also aired in the U.S. I do recall seeing them either in the late 1980s or early 1990s.

I thought so, but wasn't sure. Perhaps it was on A&E, around the same time they aired the monochrome episodes of The Avengers. My grandfather was a big fan of The Saint and being the old codger that he was, always considered Rog Simon Templar rather than James Bond.

They aired on Eoncore's Mystery channel in early 2000s.

Awesome car and license plate, Jaguar! (Though for some reason I'd figured you for a Jag man....)

Well, I do have 4 Jags as well

[St Louis]

In danger of going slightly off-topic, but were you a fan of Templar's XJS in Return of the Saint?

[jaguar007]

In danger of going slightly off-topic, but were you a fan of Templar's XJS in Return of the Saint?

Yes,while it is not my favorite Jag, I do like them. I have never owned an XJS, although one day I would certainly like to ( I have driven a few of them).

[Guy Haines]

We cannot forget the episode (I think "Luella" off the top of my head), where David Hedison was in it. THere was a scene where Templar secretly told a lady that he was James Bond and his friend (Hedison) was his friend from the FBI. Bit of prophesy perhaps?

I watched "Luella" last night. It must be one of the funniest episodes of The Saint I have seen so far. More of a "Whitehall farce" at times than a typical episode. The comedy, though, is largely down to the blatant, most likely intentional over acting of David Hedison as Templar's American pal who is the victim of a blackmail set up. He shows a real flair for humour, with Roger Moore pretty much as his straight man, though adding the odd dry witticism on cue.

It also features two actresses with very similar names - Suzanne Lloyd as Hedison's wife, and Susan Lloyd as the woman who sets up the blackmail scam (She takes Hedison back to her flat, and just as things start to get intimate, an "outraged husband" with a photographer in tow turns up and its "flash, bang, wallop"!)

Suzanne Lloyd, by the way, must have appeared as a female guest star in more Saint episodes than most - Annette Andre (of Randall and Hopkirk Deceased fame) reckoned she was the "most used bird" in The Saint, but I think Suzanne may have outdone her in appearances.

And, yes, this is the episode in which James Bond is mentioned. Right at the end, a lady who has helped Templar turns up and mentions his "FBI" friends (David Hedison and Suzanne Lloyd), and then says to The Saint, "and to think I've helped James Bond. Er, you are James Bond, aren't you?"

Roger just gives his trademark smile, looks upwards, and, unusually, the halo appears at the end of the episode.

[Guy Haines]

I started this one because the other thread looked like it was a discussion of the possible new movie and the Val Kilmer disaster. I was focusing this thread on the Moore Series.

A thread focusing on the classic original TV series is long overdue. Besides that, I'm anxious to watch the program again as my only exposure to The Saint was when BBC America aired the color episodes back in 2004--God forbid should a contemporary network broadcast something in Black & White *Gasp!*--so I haven't seen those earlier seasons, which are reputed to be superior.

Anyway, I liked the few that what I did see--a lot! Some of the episodes that stand out are The Queen's Ransom and Interlude in Venice , the latter having that Bond connection with guest Lois Maxwell.

The one I really need to see is the dry run for The Persuaders!, The Ex-King of Diamonds, which has Rog teamed up with Stuart Damon. I believe both shows use the same font for episode titles and cast credits, too. Does anyone know the name of that font?

Lois Maxwell appeared in one or two Saint episodes, including "Simon and Delilah" in which she plays a film publicist who helps Templar foil a kidnap plot, one of the victims being a spoilt brat of a film star played by, you'll never guess, Suzanne Lloyd! (See my post about "Luella".)

And while "Ex King Of Diamonds" does seem like a "Persuaders" prototype, it has nods in the direction of Casino Royale and Thunderball, imo. There's a card game pitting Templar against a corpulent card sharp, a motor yacht with high tech stuff aboard, and as mentioned TB's Paul Stassino as one of the villains. And he was another actor who made more than one appearance in The Saint.

[Guy Haines]

Watched something unexpected today. "M" beating the living daylights out of Bond. Well, not quite. It was a second series episode of The Saint, in which Robert Brown gave Roger Moore a good hiding. The episode, which had an espionage theme, was called "The Miracle Tea Party".

And Paul Stassino turned up, again, in an episode called "The Death Penalty", playing, oddly enough, an Emilio Largo type character complete with yacht who is attempting to take over a SPECTRE style outfit called "The Latini". Needless to say, he fails!

[Guy Haines]

Today I watched the colour episode of The Saint entitled "When Spring Is Sprung". Apart from Chief Inspector Claude Eustace Teal at his most erascable, it featured a scene familiar to fans of TSWLM. Templar is asked for a light, is about to provide one, bows his head slightly towards to "ciggie" and, surprise, a powder spouts out of it rendering ST incapable.

Low and behold, some ten years later, Roger as Bond falls for the same trick!

[Guy Haines]

Yesterday I watched a rather spooky episode of The Saint entitled "Sibao", which has echoes of Roger Moore's first Bond film. Set in Haiti, involves voodoo, and features a beautiful female title character who has the power of voodoo, and is due to be married to a villain who has designs on political domination of the Caribbean and South America. There are no drug deals involved, and the villain is, oddly enough, white. He's played by John Carson, who appeared in several "Saint" episodes, and seemed to specıalıse in playing cut-glass "English" types who were seldom what they seemed.

(I'd like to add, by the way, that John Carson would have made a pretty good Bond arch villain, of the cultured, well spoken, trying-to-be-more-English-than-the-English type. There's a scene in "Sibao" when Carson's character invites Templar to dinner, and it is a typical villain wining, dining, and drugging our hero scene, of the kind one can imagine in a Bond film.)

It featured Simon Templar supposedly "killed" and some voodoo scenes quite similar to those of LALD. But the whole episode was quite bizarre, with some scenes left completely unexplained, including the villain's inevitable demise. But, as Templar said at the start of the episode - "That's voodoo!"

[Brannigan]

I just watched The Saint Plays with Fire and found no less than FOUR Bond alums in the episode: Joseph Furst (Dr. Metz) and Joe Robinson (Peter Franks) both from DAF, Robert Brown from TSWLM, Octopussy, TLD, and TLK; and John Hollis (uncredited Blofeld) from FYEO. Quite a guest cast for this episode, and one of the better ones. I have to admit not all of the Saint episodes are exciting so far (I am midway through Season 2) but all of them are watchable and the guest cast tends to be a who's who of British movies.