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Actresses (better) suited to the role of Christmas Jones?


56 replies to this topic

#31 Grard Bond

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 10:10 PM

I always thought of Denise Richards as a fun character who you don't realy have to take very seriously.

What I mean is: they invented this character deliberately like this.


Edited by Grard Bond, 04 July 2014 - 02:02 PM.


#32 glidrose

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 11:33 PM

I also don't mind Richards in the role. Don't understand what the (negative) fuss was about her.



#33 LKane

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 12:35 AM

Exactly right, grandBond & Glidrose...

If you read the Dana Stevens draft of TWINE floating around everywhere on the net, it states that Dr. Christmas Jones is in her mid-twenties - the same age as Richards and Henstridge. Natasha would've nailed the role because she comes across as mature and serious despite actually being 3 years younger than Denise. But since Henstridge's recent childbirth was just three weeks or so before TWINE's casting began, she couldn't take the role despite meeting with EON about it. She said this in an interview years ago. If Henstridge had played Christmas I doubt anyone would've been up in arms afterwards. But honestly Denise is just fine playing what appears to be a smart ass ballbuster recently out of Grad school (and a bad relationship?) and working a pay-your-dues S*** job dismantling nukes in the ass-end of Kazakhstan surrounded by horny leering Russkies. Hence her avoiding "those kinds of questions". And memories of that bad relationship? Wish they would've paid off that setup...

And remember two things guys and gals: 1. Roger Ebert called Richards first-rate as Christmas; and 2. the casting short list after first-choice-Henstridge passed was down to Denise - or two chicks from the freakin' SPICE GIRLS and 90210!

In other words , EON was bound and determined to go all "Lynn Holly Johnson" with the role of Dr. Christmas Jones.... And if we can't have Henstridge in the role, then I'll take Richards over Ginger Spice or Kelly Kapowski. Any day.

And here is the link to the interview where it's mentioned that Henstridge was approached for the role but had to decline because of her recent birthing of her son:

http://www.sheknows....usive-interview

Edited by LKane, 04 July 2014 - 12:44 AM.


#34 tdalton

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 04:31 AM

There's nothing wrong with Denise Richards in The World is Not Enough.  Her and the Dr. Christmas Jones character are far from the biggest problem with that terrible film.  



#35 Hansen

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 08:01 AM

Hey tdalton,

Can you develop on this ?

I consider TWINE as a missed opportunity. Pretty good plot. Good villains, great Pierce but it does not come together. Slow pace, poor sequences : ski chase, Casino scene...



#36 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 10:29 AM

Barbara Windsor?

 

barbara1.jpg

 

OK, that's going too far!

 

Babs isn't better  suited to the role..... she's about even  with Richards   ;)

 

 

 

 

...the Dr. Christmas Jones character are far from the biggest problem with that terrible film.  

 

Agreed. The biggest problem is that it has 2 directors with totally different styles.

 

It flip-flops from Apted's sedate, introspective cerebrum, to Vic Armstrong's bish-bash-bosh-BANG by the numbers action set-pieces.

 

The result is a bloody mess that makes it tonely more akin to the original Casino Royale than to an Eon movie.

 

Sure, many Bond movies suffer from this, but TWINE took it to a whole new level.


Edited by Odd Jobbies, 04 July 2014 - 10:31 AM.


#37 LKane

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 02:33 PM

I think TWINE was taking those first baby steps towards the more serious and melancholy tone of the Craig films - but didn't fully commit. While it isn't perfect it may have paved the way for some of the more grounded tropes that abound in the last three flicks - especially M's past coming back to give her a right spanking. It's just that as OddJobbie said: the lack of 100% commitment to being more serious gives the film a somewhat dual personality feel... Then DIE ANOTHER DAY happened and the reaction to that film gave EON the impetus to fully embrace a more serious approach instead of half assing it. Hence the reboot that probably extended the franchise's life...

And given the recent hoopla about Bond24 being rewritten to add more humor, I hope we don't end up with a movie that has the same split personality as TWINE...

Edited by LKane, 04 July 2014 - 02:40 PM.


#38 tdalton

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 03:14 PM

The lack of focus certainly didn't help The World is Not Enough, but I think what doomed it even more than that was that both of the dueling styles were done terribly.  The action sequences were awful and the "dramatic" scenes were even worse.



#39 LKane

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 03:20 PM

Agreed, TDalton... After seeing TWINE in 99 I remember commenting to a friend how little action there was in the film. But we ultimately realized there was plenty of action but it was done very mechanically. Hence barely registering and almost being forgettable and making us feel we'd seen less than we actually did... I keep wondering how much better TWINE would have been with Martin Campbell directing it....

#40 FlemingBond

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 05:14 PM

The action in those films was beginning to feel like video-game stuff just thrown in irregardless of the story.

i've always felt the character should have been a man. I think having it a woman took emphasis off the Bond-Elektra relationship. Plus, Richards just looked too young next to Brosnan. She was 27, looking like 21.



#41 Professor Pi

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 05:54 PM

I always wanted to see Polly Walker in a Bond film (Patriot Games, recently Clash of the Titans and John Carter).  She would have been 33 at the time.

MV5BODUwMDAwMTgxNl5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTYwNDY5dejahthoris01.jpg



#42 LKane

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 03:13 AM

Fleming Bond, you are on to something that EON obviously was aware of in pre production: in the Dana Stevens draft of TWINE, there are moments of light flirtation and suggestive innuendo throughout between Christmas Jones and Bond ...

In Bruce Feirstein's polish which became the shooting script, these scenes are either dropped or rewritten to be more brisk and no-nonsense. Christmas and Bond are pretty much all business to each other in the final film because their more familiar partnership on the previous draft did indeed make Bond's connection to Elektra look weaker. Overall, though, I prefer Dana Stevens' draft because Christmas comes across as more authoritative and involved - and it actually strengthened the story. But in addition to removing the flirty bits between Bond and Christmas, Feirstein unfortunately also scaled her role back a tad to give Bond more moments to shine. Not really wise since the best recent Bond films like GE and LTK gave their Lead Bond Girls' their own set pieces and mini missions. I mean Christmas was far from useless and Apted has said in interviews that they tried to give her stuff to do besides stand around and look pretty. However given the fact that Christmas comes into the story halfway through, very late, they should have just removed the flirtatious bits with Bond from Dana Stevens' draft and not scaled Christmas back to accommodate Bond's or Brosnan's ego - that way Christmas could've made a bigger impact in the shorter amount of time - compared to her co stars - that she had in the film.

I read somewhere that Brosnan felt the women were taking over in Stevens' script and so Feirstein was brought in to put Bond in " his rightful place." Not so sure it was so rightful. Based on that account and other comments I've read attributed to Brosnan, I'm starting to think the dude is a bit of a whiny crybaby... Glad they got rid of him....

Edited by LKane, 05 July 2014 - 03:14 AM.


#43 FlemingBond

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 06:53 PM

I don't know about that. In those years it really got tiresome for the Bond girls to be promoted as Bond's partner's basically. We saw that in the previous film TND, then again with Jinx in DAD. With the Craig movies they've gotten back to having interesting women that don't have to be Bond's physlcal equal.

At any rate that's interesting  what you shared. Bond use to have some interesting male ally's in the older film's. I think that the Christmas Jones character would have been a good place for that. It's like they wanted to do a serious film about Bond and Elektra, but they wouldn't push it all the way. Finally they did with Casino Royale and QOS.



#44 LKane

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 11:54 PM

Hi Fleming Bond, I agree with you to a point - but it's not about making the Bond Girl his physical equal, but to give them interesting things and atypical paths to take. Natalya from GE was the best Bond Girl because was nowhere near Bonds physical equal but managed to hold her own whether with Bond or alone. I do agree that the Jinx and Wai Lin type of Bond girl is not so great. Wai Lin worked because of Michelle Yeoh's skill but Jinx was just awful.

That said, I have to disagree to a point with you about the Craig films and their use of Bond Girls. They do okay using the first girl (Vesper, Camille, Eve) but always turn the second Bond Girl into basically expendable cannon-fodder. And the reports about the secondary Scandinavian Bond girl in Bond 24 being "a brief love interest" to Bond again suggests she won't be above ground for too long... Really, EON?

#45 jamie00007

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 03:59 AM

I think almost any actress from the period would have been more suitable. I know a character like Christmas Jones (superhot nuclear scientist in a tank top with a gag name) isnt really meant to be taken too seriously, but casting Denise Richards was like putting Pamela Anderson in a Bond film. 

 

I'd have liked:

 

Mira Sorvino

Claire Forlani

Julie Delpy

Bridget Fonda

Jewel

Liv Tyler



#46 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 08:38 AM

How about Lassie?

 

LassieBlur.jpg

 

One bark for   "I've got a PHD...."

 

Two barks for   "...And very large breasts."

 

Couldn't be any worse than Richards!

 



#47 Grard Bond

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 11:53 AM

That ofcourse would have been the nr one choice, unfortunately Lassie was already too old in 1999 to play that part credibly.



#48 LKane

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Posted 06 July 2014 - 11:37 PM

Ha ha Ha. EON would've forced Lassie to use a depilatory cream first... : ). Nothing more unattractive than short shorts and, um, hairy legs... ; )

#49 Bourbon Woman

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 03:55 AM

The concept of the character is inherently silly. "Smoking-hot top-heavy nuclear scientist" is going to be cartoony and obnoxious no matter who you cast. I would have rewritten the role as a more grounded and plausible character with subtler charms, in the tradition of Natalya Simyonova, and cast somebody like Gillian Anderson. 



#50 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 09:06 AM

TBH the character feels like an add on.

 

The story is 100% about another Bond love affair gone wrong - another betrayal, like Vesper.

 

IMO it's a strong premiss until you factor in Richards. No doubt Eon feared it was too dower and wanted some tits'n ass for Bond to letch over. Suddenly theres a barbie-doll nuclear physicist with a rack popping up to give us unnecessary exposition about nuclear whatever which has never been needed in past movies.

 

Basically i think Eon bottled it and screwed up a strong and focused premiss. i imagine the extra screen time needed for this character was taken away from other characters, namely Renard, who barely features, despite the promotionals pushing him as the scary big-bad.

 

I'd also guess they hooked Apted on the script before adding Richards' Carry-On titty-scientist. Poor guy signs up to something tonally akin to FRWL, but has to shoot something more akin to TSWLM.  He's not a Carry-On director, which is why the whole thing is an uneven mess. I may be wrong, but the movie finished movie says that something went wrong.


Edited by Odd Jobbies, 07 July 2014 - 09:11 AM.


#51 glidrose

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 05:50 PM

Part one:
 

TBH the character feels like an add on.

The story is 100% about another Bond love affair gone wrong - another betrayal, like Vesper.

IMO it's a strong premiss


premise

 

until you factor in Richards. No doubt Eon feared it was too dower


dour

 

and wanted some tits'n ass for Bond to letch over. Suddenly theres


there's

 

a barbie-doll


no hyphen

 

nuclear physicist with a rack popping up


out

 

to give us unnecessary exposition about nuclear whatever which has never been needed in past movies.


Stacy Sutton in AVTAK: geology, mine faults, etc.

 

Basically i


I

 

think Eon bottled it


Is it spring water?

 

and screwed up a strong and focused premiss.


premise

 

i


I

 

imagine the extra screen time needed for this character was taken away from other characters, namely Renard, who barely features, despite the promotionals pushing him as the scary big-bad.


no hyphen; missing noun "big bad" modifies. Wolf?

 

I'd also guess they hooked Apted on the script


Did it hurt? Did he get the hook out?

 

before adding Richards' Carry-On titty-scientist.


No hyphen for "Carry-On" or "titty-scientist". How does "titty" get past the forum censor?

 

Poor guy signs up to


for

 

something tonally akin to FRWL, but has to shoot something more akin to TSWLM. He's not a Carry-On


no hyphen

#52 glidrose

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 05:59 PM

Part two:

director, which is why the whole thing is an uneven mess. I may be wrong, but the movie finished movie


"Movie finished movie?" Is that like "Bond, James Bond?"


says that something went wrong.

Edited by Odd Jobbies, Today, 09:11 AM.


You're not a copy editor at the Guardian by any chance? :P :D

Try the veal. I'll be here all week.

Yes I'm a total wanker.

#53 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 07:00 PM

Yes I'm a total wanker.

 

 

Agreed  ;)



#54 glidrose

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Posted 07 July 2014 - 10:35 PM

Agreed   ;)


You forgot the full stop.



#55 LKane

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Posted 08 July 2014 - 12:36 AM

OddJobbie and Glidrose, I think you two need to be the ones to rewrite Bond 24! ; )

#56 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 08 July 2014 - 10:25 AM

 

Agreed   ;)


You forgot the full stop.

 

How about two of them    ..7


OddJobbie and Glidrose, I think you two need to be the ones to rewrite Bond 24! ; )

The new P&W  (Punctuation & Wanker)



#57 LKane

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Posted 08 July 2014 - 12:02 PM

Love it! : )