57 replies to this topic

[zencat]

Wouldn't it have been cool if Paris Carver in TND was Sylvia Carver, aka Sylvia Trench! You know, Bond's "regular" girlfriend from DR. NO and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE. I always liked the idea of Silvia and think this would have been a very clever way to tie into the earlier films. After all, Sylvia was Bond's first onscreen conquest, and remember how mad Silvia would get when Bond had to jet off on a mission? Seems to justify that slap in TND and her line about Bond saying, "I'll be right back." I don't know, I just think this would have been nifty. But I'm a geek.

[Blue Eyes]

White Persian (24 Aug, 2001 11:40 a.m.):
OK, here goes...
Geoffrey Boothroyd, the arms expert Ian Flenimg named "Q" after, appears as an extra in the Q branch scene in Goldfinger.

Worried about the risque implications of the name "Pussy Galore", the producers considered changing the character's name to "Pussy Abundant"

Well the first one we can disprove. Because in his last interview Llwellyn revealed he had never met the really Boothroyd but did want to!

And from memory producers were going to change the name to Kitty Galore at the request of UA. But an EON PR guy told the world media of Pussy Galore so that they wouldn't be able to change it. Something like that. Of course, that too could be an urban myth

[White Persian]

Blue Eyes (28 Jul, 2001 03:47 a.m.):
Actually that's something I'd really love to start. An urban myth section about Bond!

OK, here goes...
Geoffrey Boothroyd, the arms expert Ian Flenimg named "Q" after, appears as an extra in the Q branch scene in Goldfinger.

Worried about the risque implications of the name "Pussy Galore", the producers considered changing the character's name to "Pussy Abundant"

Because Robert Brown had co-starred with Roger Moore in Ivanhoe (as his squire), as a joke, M was wearing doublet and hose behind his desk in the briefing scene of Moonraker.

In OHMSS, George Baker isn't dubbing George Lazenby's lines as Sir Hillary Bray. Lazenby is actually a gifted mimic.

Yes it was Roger Moore driving the double decker bus under the low bridge in LALD! Unfortunately, the bus was supposed to JUMP OVER the bridge.

Richard "Jaws" Kiel is actually only 5 feet 11 inches tall. He was made to appear taller by filming Roger Moore standing in a trench.

And Herve Villechaise was of normal height, but slouched for the camera.

[General Koskov]

Can they really be urban myths if they weren't invented in an urban area? Not that I know where some were made up, but...y'know.

[General Koskov]

zencat (01 Jul, 2001 05:54 p.m.):
Who's left? Bond's shrink?

You mean Sir James Molony? I hope not!

Perhaps the cleaning lady at Legoland? ;d

[Xenobia]

Zencat you are genius! Your name change would have solved my major with the film:

With Paris Carver as she is in TND we have no idea why this woman got under Bond's skin the way she evidently did. At least if we understood that she was Sylvia Trench, that keeps the continuity going, and part of the history that Bond and she shared.

That being said, even with that history from "Dr. No" and "From Russia With Love," I personally would be hard pressed to figure out how Sylvia / Paris got "too close for comfort."

Adding to this problem is, and I know some folks here will disagree, there was absolutely *nothing* in Terri Hatcher's performance to convince me that she was the type of woman Bond could love, or almost love and then stop himself.

Like I said Zencat, a brilliant idea, that would have worked, had Terri Hatcher not been the actress playing Mrs. Carver.

-- Xenobia

[Blue Eyes]

Xenobia (22 May, 2002 11:34 p.m.):
That being said, even with that history from "Dr. No" and "From Russia With Love," I personally would be hard pressed to figure out how Sylvia / Paris got "too close for comfort."

You see I'd disagree. Trench mysteriously disappears after From Russia With Love never to be heard from again. Why? Did something happen between From Russia With Love and Goldfinger? We could easily presume so. We know that James Bond exists outside the films, that is, he does more than just save the world every few years. Just because we don't see it on the screen doesn't mean it hasn't happened within Bond's world.

[Blofeld's Cat]

Blue Eyes (22 May, 2002 11:42 p.m.):
Trench mysteriously disappears after From Russia With Love never to be heard from again. Why? Did something happen between From Russia With Love and Goldfinger? We could easily presume so. We know that James Bond exists outside the films, that is, he does more than just save the world every few years. Just because we don't see it on the screen doesn't mean it hasn't happened within Bond's world.

The way I understand it, the Sylvia Trench character was all Terence Young's idea.

So when he left the series so did Miss Trench. Pity about that.

[Hardyboy]

I don't know if the character was Young's idea, but it was Young's idea to make her a recurring character and that the joke would be that her attempts to be "alone" with Bond would forever be frustrated. Once Guy Hamilton came on board, though, Sylvia was dropped. . .and poor Eunice Gayson had a hard time after that: her career hit the skids in the late '60s and she was arrested for shoplifting in 1974. Could it be that notorious Bond-girl curse. . .?

[General Koskov]

Speaking of Eunice Gayson's crimes, how did she break into Bond's flat? You'd think a 00 agent would have a lock on the door!

[ray t]

wow!

august 31, 2001 to
may 22 2002

Quite a Massive gap on this thread between post 16 and post 17

Daniel, what became of Zencat's great idea?

Did your e-mailing the idea to official people lead to anything?

Is sylvia going to make a comeback in any future bonds...or has she gone by the way of terrence young?

[Xenobia]

So many folks to answer in so little time, I will try to address you all briefly:

As I understand it, Terrance Young was definately involved in Sylvia Trench returning for "From Russia With Love." Whether TY hired EG or not, I am not sure, but her double appearance was due to him, and her disapperance was also due to him leaving the series.

That being said, Blue Eyes is right, things to happen between movies (and books) that we do not see or know of. But again, the same problem I have with Teri Hatcher I have with Eunice Grayson: there is nothing in that performance to show me that this is a woman that can get under Bond's skin. (And yes, we have seen women get under Bond's skin, and I just don't mean Tracy Bond.)

One way or another, it would take a phenemonal actress, (as well as PB's usual great acting) and some very tight writing to make me believe that a particular woman got under Bond's skin.

-- Xenobia

[rafterman]

fantastic idea, it would have made so much more sense and been very easy to do...

[zencat]

Digitarius (23 Aug, 2001 12:12 p.m.):
But Teri Hatcher has such an on-screen presence, it would be a pity if she hadn't been in Tomorrow Never Dies. She should've played Sylvia Trench herself.

Yes, my thinking was you still use Teri Hatcher (I reallly liked her too) but you name her character Sylvia Carver aka Sylvia Trench.

[Blue Eyes]

My God! Zencat! Brilliant! I never really thought of that. But what a great continuation. General viewers would just react normally and we'd all be going, oh my god! It's Trench!! Wow. How cool!!

So ace idea. Now to e-mail some official people with the idea ;p

[Jacques Nexus]

You constantly amaze me zencat !...nice idea...perhaps in future films Dr Molly Warmflash should be made a continuing character, one which 007 treats the same way as he used to do to Sylvia Trench. She dropped hints in TWINE that 007 wasn't giving her enough attention !.

[zencat]

It's a little off topic, but since you mentioned Warmflash...have you ever noticed how Bond's first conquest in each of the Pierce movies is always professional woman w/ ties to MI6? In GoldenEye it's his service evaluator. In TND it's his language professor. In TWINE it's his doctor. Is this is new "tradition", or coincidence? I hope it's a new tradition because we can speculate who could be conquest #1 in Bond 20. Who's left? Bond's shrink?

[WhitePersian]

zencat (01 Jul, 2001 05:54 p.m.):
It's a little off topic, but since you mentioned Warmflash...have you ever noticed how Bond's first conquest in each of the Pierce movies is always professional woman w/ ties to MI6? In GoldenEye it's his service evaluator. In TND it's his language professor. In TWINE it's his doctor. Is this is new "tradition", or coincidence? I hope it's a new tradition because we can speculate who could be conquest #1 in Bond 20. Who's left? Bond's shrink?

Or Moneypenny? Or M?

[Blue Eyes]

WhitePersian (17 Jul, 2001 11:11 p.m.):
Or Moneypenny? Or M?

Please NO, for M anyway

[Blue Eyes]

But I'm still sticking by this! I think it's an excellent idea.

We're constantly reminded that Bond had a past, damnit everyone does, but we never see it. Why not? I don't mean flash backs but it would have been fantastic if Paris Carver had been Silvia Trench.

Why don't the writers/producers think of these things?

If PC had be ST then:

1) Non fans would not have had a changed background. We still could have been given the exact same information and known was what going on.

2) Fans would have watched the film in awe. We'd know what had happened to a character and love it! It would have made the film all the better!

That's my say

[mccartney007]

zencat (29 Jun, 2001 10:52 p.m.):
Wouldn't it have been cool if Paris Carver in TND was Silvia Carver, aka Silvia Trench! You know, Bond's "regular" girlfriend from DR. NO and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE. I always liked the idea of Silvia and think this would have been a very clever way to tie into the earlier films. After all, Silvia was Bond's first onscreen conquest, and remember how mad Silvia would get when Bond had to jet off on a mission? Seems to justify that slap in TND and her line about Bond saying, "I'll be right back." I don't know, I just think this would have been nifty. But I'm a geek.

Great idea! Eunice Gayson's daughter is about the right age for being a Bond girl. If the producers really wanted to use that idea they could use Gayson's daughter. Speaking of Gayson's daughter, wasn't she in GoldenEye in the casino scene?

[zencat]

Was she? That's news to me. Cool.

[Blue Eyes]

I had heard that somewhere before. Where she appears and what she looks like I have no idea. It may just be an urban mythy.

Actually that's something I'd really love to start. An urban myth section about Bond!

[RossMan]

I never really thought about that but sounds like it would have worked very well. If they had used Silvia, they would not have had to create a new Bond girl and make up a past between her and Bond. A lot of the things that Paris said/complainedd about are reminicent of Silvia.
That would also give a sense of continuity between the new and old films.
Great idea, too bad they never thougth of that when they made TND!!!

[Digitarius]

That is a great idea.

But Teri Hatcher has such an on-screen presence, it would be a pity if she hadn't been in Tomorrow Never Dies. She should've played Sylvia Trench herself.

[WillieGarvin]

Wonderful idea.It answers all the unanswered questions surrounding the mysterious Bond/Paris relationship.Too bad this wasn't in the movie.

[zencat]

Nice list there, White Persian.

But now back to Silivia...I mean, Paris.

Even though her death scene was excellent, I can't help but feel the movie died with her. There was a very nice triangle set up there between Carver, Bond, and Paris and I would have liked to have seen her stick around and play a part in the climax. Perhaps Carver is torturing her aboard the Stealth Boat (or strapped to the missile?) thus motivating Bond to go in after her. I never felt there was a romance between Bond and Wai Lin and I missed this element. Of course, who would Bond end up with in the end? Both girls? Hummm...that could have been a first.

[PrinceKamalKhan]

The Paris/Sylvia discussion on "Bond, Your director's cut" in General Bond Film Discussion inspired me to revive this thread.

Wouldn't it have been cool if Paris Carver in TND was Silvia Carver, aka Silvia Trench! You know, Bond's "regular" girlfriend from DR. NO and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE. I always liked the idea of Silvia and think this would have been a very clever way to tie into the earlier films. After all, Silvia was Bond's first onscreen conquest, and remember how mad Silvia would get when Bond had to jet off on a mission? Seems to justify that slap in TND and her line about Bond saying, "I'll be right back." I don't know, I just think this would have been nifty. But I'm a geek.

Very interesting idea, zencat. It would have been nice to see the Sylvia character back again but Paris reminded me more of Tiffany Case than Miss Trench. Both Paris and Tiffany were American and had a certain brassiness about themselves. The banter between Paris and Bond at the party reminded me of the banter between Tiffany and Bond in her Amsterdam apartment. I could easily see the opportunistic Tiffany marrying a megabillionaire like Carver for his money so she could retrieve the diamonds from the satellite. Also, Jill St. John and Teri Hatcher kinda remind me of each other anyway.

Even though her death scene was excellent, I can't help but feel the movie died with her. There was a very nice triangle set up there between Carver, Bond, and Paris and I would have liked to have seen her stick around and play a part in the climax. Perhaps Carver is torturing her aboard the Stealth Boat (or strapped to the missile?) thus motivating Bond to go in after her. I never felt there was a romance between Bond and Wai Lin and I missed this element.

I agree with you, zencat. I thought Bond/Wai Lin was too reminiscent of the much more interesting Bond/Anya pairing from The Spy Who Loved Me and it just generated a "been there, done that" response from me. I liked the Alfred Hitchcock's Notorious-like element of the Bond/Paris relationship and hope that EON recycles the basic concept of "Bond running across an old flame now married or tied to the villain" and does it better in a future Bond film.

[Strangways]

So, great minds think alike...just four years apart..

[Loomis]

I think Paris Carver should definitely not have been Sylvia Trench. There's no indication in DR. NO or FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE that Bond and Sylvia Trench were ever in love. Pretty darn clear that they were both of 'em in it purely for the shagging. "What's the matter, James? Did I get too close?"/"Yes" (with Bond looking as though he's about to start crying) would have been absolutely ludicrous with Sylvia Trench (fair enough, it's a pretty awful, embarrassing and unintentionally comical scene as it is, though, thanks largely to horrible dialogue and acting).

And I know there's nothing in DR. NO or FRWL to suggest this, but I've always assumed Sylvia Trench to be married already. There's a line in "Moonraker" about Bond "making love with rather cold passion" to two or three married women in London on a regular basis (or something like that), and it's easy to picture Sylvia Trench as one of those women.