29 replies to this topic

[pgram]

I just read the thread about Alfred Hitchcock and can't help introducing this thread.

Fritz Lang is my favourite film director. His most famous film, Metropolis, is probably one of the most influential films of all time. Yet, this thread is about his (obvious to me) connections to early Bond films. I will list evidence that show that early Bond filmakers were -at least- influenced by his work.

1. His silent film, The spy, (Spione) introduces an agent (Bond like) receiving orders from a superior in a sequence very much resembling M's office sequences. The film starts with a sequence that establishes the criminal organisation as a world wide threat, in a way much similar to a Bond PTS. The rest of the film, which could make an excellent Bond film, is an espionage story with femme fatales, larger than life criminals and lots of action. It is interesting to note that Lang came up with Haggy, the villain, from newspaper headlines, like Fleming and Bond screenwriters did.

2. His film, Dr Mabuse, the Gambler, is about another Blofeld like villain, in larger than life capers. Dr Mabuse is confronted by District attorney Von Venck in casinos, theatres and in a universe that could be Bond's.

3. His film, The last Will of Dr Mabuse, is about a criminal organisation whose operants receive orders by a leader whom they don't see, but just listen to his voice, in a scene exactly similar to the one in TB. The rest of the film resembles Bond in many ways, although the subject is rather different.

4. In The thousand Eyes of Dr Mabuse you have another Bond like rarger than life villain. The police comissioner after him is Gert Frobbe.

5. The Indian Tomb was filmed in a palace that seems to be -if it isn't- Octopussy's palace.

6. In my favourite film of Lang, M, stars Peter -Le chiffre- Lorre.

7. In Manhunt the lead star Walter Pidgeon is the closest I 've ever seen to Fleming's Bond. After a torture scene he even gets scarred on the cheek. Since the film was released in the Forties, I can' t help thinking that Fleming had seen it and was influenced by it (OK, I know about Carmichael... just see the film and you 'll know what I mean)

8. Lang was a personal friend of Pabst and Brecht. They filmed Die 3groschenoper, starring the composer Kurt Weill's wife, Lotte Lenya.

9. An indirect influence: Early Bond was influenced by Hitchcock, who has admitted being influenced by Lang (and vice versa).

10. I know this is getting far fetched, but another hero who has obviously copied Lang is Tintin, who, IMHO, is James Bond Jr (but this could be another big conversation). And Lang's The Spiders, are early Indiana Jones films (another big conversation).

11. His second american film, starring Henry Fonda is named You Only live Once.

12. Last (and definitely least), since Largo's description in the book TB is very different than Adolfo Celli's, I find it they were just imitating Lang himself.

I am rather curious if there is anyone else who knows what I 'm saying. Anyway, if you haven't seen these films (which is not improbable), do it! You 'll find it worth the while, even if you don't buy my arguments.

The reason for my posting this thread is that I want to share my passion for Lang with people who share another passion with me. And if you find that you agree with me, this would be a summary of the direction Bond filmmakers should go with the next films.

[spynovelfan]

Interesting stuff, pgram. I must watch some more Lang! Presumably you've read The Rogue Director: A Spyography of Fritz Lang? You'll need to scroll down to find it if not.

Agree with you on Tintin - I've often wondered if Fleming had read Herge and mentioned that in this thread. It seems clear that Indiana Jones was inspired by Tintin and Bond - Spielberg's a massive fan of both.

Lang always carried a Browning revolver with him.

[pgram]

No, I haven't read it, I will go after it, thanks. I just finished rereading Lotte Eisner's "Fritz Lang" which is the ultimate evaluation of his work.

As far as Tintin is concerned, the whole Destination Moon is a copy of Woman on the moon. The train sequence in Prisoners of the sun is taken directly from The spy. I read Michael Farr's, "Tintin, the complete companion" and there was no reference to Lang. I just can't see why. And Petra in the Last Crusade comes directly from Red sea sharks. Have you seen Spiders? It does resemble Indy, although it can be argued that it was a copy of American continuation films itself.

Anyway, do revisit Lang. I prefer his early, silent German period, but the American is excellent, too. You know, I probably would not be posting this thread if I did not believe that Lang's influence on -mainly- Young defined the Bond film atmosphere.

By the way, point 13 would be Ken Adam. He was German and was influenced by the expressionism movement. He has said so, and you can see it in all his sets.

[pgram]

I just read the article and your post, spynovelfan. You really made my night.
Rogue Director was exactly what I had in mind. I have some objections to some of the information (e.g. Haggy was based on Trotsky, not Lenin) but they are not significant. The idea is 100% on target.
And you are 100% on target about Tintin. He is James Bond Jr. Sure, no sex, but that is what Jr stands for. Now, if you have read all the Tintin's you must have noticed that the early ones seem more raw, which gives them a Lang feel. Just like the early Bonds. I 'd say their relationship was actually made too obvious in The lake of the sharks: you can only see the villain's hand in his lair, he ends up being Rastapopoulos, but could easily be Blofeld.

[pgram]

Thanks, Chimera.

If you can actually find Spionne, just go for it. It is excellent. (Nibbelungens are great as well, both of them). Can you really find a DVD of Spionne? I could not back in Greece. I had to watch them in a special retrospective screening of all of Lang's films in the International Film Festival of Thessaloniki. If you can, could you let me know, I 'd like to own them myself.
And a piece of advice. All of Lang's film have been restored by Friedrich Wilhelm Murnau stifftung in, I think, 2000. If you can, get these versions, they are much better than previous ones. Metropolis, for example, had another 20 or 30 minutes of film, and the scenes were rearranged from earlier versions, that now, actually, makes sense.

[Loomis]

I've only seen METROPOLIS, many years ago, an 8mm print screened in total silence apart from the whirring of the projector, which obviously imparts much more atmosphere than you'd get from, say, a DVD.

Definitely one of the all-time greats of filmmaking, Lang, but for one reason or another I just haven't managed to catch anything else of his. Must rectify that, though.

Which other directors are you fond of, pgram? (Without wishing to take a Lang thread too off-topic.)

[pgram]

I always believed that if one is not too intimidated by the absence of sound, he will find that Lang's cinema is in many ways much more modern than today's.
I know what you are saying about Metropolis. I had the pleasure to watch the restored version at the Philharmonic Hall of Thessaloniki with a new score performed by a symphonic orchestra. The greatest film experience of my life...
Other directors... To stay in the same period, F.W.Murnau was a true master. I also love Bergman. I like Hitchcock (although I do find him a little overrated). Orson Welles. Akira Kurosawa. Many more...

[pgram]

Indeed, although Klaus Kinski was an excellent choice (anyway, an obvious one for Herzog). When I saw Shadow of the Vampire, I thought it was the true story of the making of Nosferatu... and I was shocked until I realised that they were pulling our legs.

Thanks for the information about the DVD's, I 'll go after them.

Have you seen Destiny (Der Mude Tod)? And what about Caligari?

[pgram]

Sure, that 'll be great.
Der Mude Tod is a classic, too. It is structured as a folk song and consists of one main story and three different episodes interwoven. All four stories take place in different time and place and actually belong to different film genres. Cinematography is superb, a feast for the eyes...
I don't believe there exists a decent copy of Caligari. At least, I haven't found any. You know, Caligari was first offered to Lang, but he proposed Wienne. And the plot twist in the finalle is believed to be Lang's contribution.

[Loomis]

I always believed that if one is not too intimidated by the absence of sound, he will find that Lang's cinema is in many ways much more modern than today's.

Absolutely. Same goes for, say, Eisenstein's.

BTW, have you read "The New Confessions" by William Boyd? If not, I think it may interest you.

ETA: Robert Wiene. Wow, there's a name you don't see mentioned much these days!

[pgram]

No, haven't heard of it. What is it about?

[Loomis]

It's a fictitious autobiography of a Scotsman who becomes (among other things) a star director in the German film industry between the two World Wars. I can't recall whether Lang makes an appearance or whether the hero is based partly on Lang. Anyway, I'm sure you'd love it - it's a wonderful novel (one of the best I've ever read, actually), and a must for film buffs.

http://www.amazon.co...5629070-1209456

And as a sort of companion piece with a special interest for Bond fans (as Ian Fleming is a character in it), check out Boyd's more recent "Any Human Heart".

http://www.amazon.co...5629070-1209456

[pgram]

Thanks, Loomis, I think I 'll have a go at them

[pgram]

OK. Now I know where I 'm going to invest my first salary...

Very happy to read "The company was responsible for bringing to market the fully restored, remastered, and most comprehensive version of the Fritz Lang classic Metropolis (1927).", because I had an argument some months ago with a know-it-all, about Metropolis, finally making sense.

Have you seen "Sunrise"? Another must-see masterpiece. The drunk waiter in Peter Sellers' "The party" is a direct reference to it.

[pgram]

And I still have to look at Der Golem and the Holy mountain with Riefenstahl as an actress.

I must say that I do enjoy Langs earlier German work. I was actually looking forward to obtaining the Nibelungen sooner or later

Well, if only one of them- Riefenstahl of Lang- was around, Troy could have been a much better film...

[pgram]

Eureka masters of cinema

http://eurekavideo.co.uk/moc/

And

http://www.dvdtimes....contentid=56988

which contains some very decent review of Spione.

Sorry to be back to this thread after so long, but I just bought the dvd of spione (thanks Chimera) and I 'd like to add some quotes of the booklet acompanying the dvd, written by film critic Jonathan Rosenbaum.

"IF Fritz Lang's Die Nibelungen (1924) anticipates the pop mythologies of everything from Fantasia to Batman to Star Wars, his master spy thriller of four years later seems to usher in some of the romantic intrigues of Graham Greene, not to mention much of the paraphernalia of Ian Fleming, especially in their movie version.........One is also tempted to speak of Alfred Hitchcock, who certainly learned a trick or two from Lang........It's difficult to refute these charges of formalism and technological fetishsm (the latter of which would return in force with the James Bond films)..........The second key image occurs much later, after we 've been introduced to N.326- a government spy disguised as a tramp who's summoned to his chief's office, where he promptly exposes the miniature hidden camera of a counterspy posing as an office assistant (the first of many James Bond gadgets avant la lettre)........"

Although I 'm convinced that the connections between Spione (and Lang in general) and early (Terence Young's) Bond are a lot more significant than those implied in the quotes above, I thought these quotes were interesting to post here to show that Lang's fans and scholars are very much aware of these connections; it is time Bond fans and scholars learnt about them as well...

[spynovelfan]

7. In Manhunt the lead star Walter Pidgeon is the closest I 've ever seen to Fleming's Bond. After a torture scene he even gets scarred on the cheek. Since the film was released in the Forties, I can' t help thinking that Fleming had seen it and was influenced by it (OK, I know about Carmichael... just see the film and you 'll know what I mean)

I think it's quite likely Fleming had seen this film. According to Andrew Lycett's biography, Fleming was so enamoured of Geoffrey Household's novel THE THIRD HOUR, written in 1937, that he sent six copies to friends. Household's next novel, ROGUE MALE, established his reputation. MANHUNT is the film adaptation of ROGUE MALE, released in 1941.

[Loomis]

I thought Fleming saw only two films in his life, one being GONE WITH THE WIND and the other being DR. NO (which he loathed). Seems a bit unlikely, and I can't recall where I got that from, but it's what I thought, I tell you.

[spynovelfan]

Surely he also saw FRWL - he went to the premiere!

[Loomis]

Surely he also saw FRWL - he went to the premiere!

I imagine he was dragged there, if what I believe he felt about DR. NO was the case.

Seriously, is it just me, or did Fleming have a loathing of cinema (and the big screen adaptations of his work)?

Sorry, I'd back this up with reference to sources, but I can't so I shan't.

[pgram]

Sorry to resurect a thread dead long ago, but I just saw 'Cloak and Dagger' on tv, and apart from all the obvious James Bond similarities, it being a spy film and so on, and despite Gary Cooper's Conneryesque phisique, I couldn't help noticing a scene when Cooper arrives at an airport in Switzerland, and there is a photographer there (presumably a Nazi) who tries to take a shot of him. Cooper avoids it by lifting his hand holding his hat and suitcase. Very similar to DN.

Nothing important of course, but I 'm just trying to write down a full list of similarities.

[Mr. Blofeld]

Seriously, is it just me, or did Fleming have a loathing of cinema (and the big screen adaptations of his work)?

Are you sure? It always seemed to me that, at least in his descriptions, Fleming was writing for the cinema (especially with Thunderball, having originally been a screenplay and all... ).

[Peckinpah1976]

I thought Fleming saw only two films in his life, one being GONE WITH THE WIND and the other being DR. NO (which he loathed). Seems a bit unlikely, and I can't recall where I got that from, but it's what I thought, I tell you.

In one of his published diaries Evelyn Waugh notes that he saw the Disney version of 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea with the Flemings' - Waugh himself hated it but recorded that Fleming was very enthusiastic about the film. When one considers the similarities between the Disney film (as apposed to the Verne book) and Fleming's Dr. No; I'd say that this has more than a ring of truth to it.

Edited by Peckinpah1976, 11 April 2009 - 12:07 PM.

[Eurospy]

I used to have his "The Spiders" serial, but only got around to watch the first half hour or so

[bondrules]

Anyone knows where one can find the trailer for Lang's Manhunt (1941)?

[bondrules]

Anyone knows where one can find the trailer for Lang's Manhunt (1941)?

Bump.

[Martini]

Nice thread! I discovered my love for silent movies during my studies of motion picture science. My favorite is The General Line of Eisenstein.

I watched Dr Mabuse The Gambler a few days ago. The story of a criminal mastermind who gets insane in the end indeed reminds of Blofeld. While watching the movie I thought that it still would be great if Mr White would be the head of Quantum. The genius of villains like Mabuse was that they assumed different roles and so where elusive. (The modern counterpart to this is among others Keyser Söze in The Usual Suspects) Appearing as a henchman of Quantum could be the perfect camouflage for it´s head.

My favorite film of Lang is Frau im Mond (Woman on the moon). The interaction between art and science here is absolutely astonishing. Sometimes I wish this for contemporary sci-fi-movies. Space flight pioneer Hermann Oberth was technical adviser to the film, and the UFA financed him a rocket launch as a promotion gag. And the countdown that initiates rocket launches until today, was an idea of Lang to make the whole thing more thrilling. So many Bond finales with a countdown like Goldfinger or Octopussy have their origins in Fritz Lang.

It´s also interesting that by the time of Frau im Mond scientist thought that the surface of the moon must be covered with a thick layer of dust, because of the long time and the absent atmosphere (what is logical). So the moon looks like the Sahara in the film.

[pgram]

Nice thread! I discovered my love for silent movies during my studies of motion picture science. My favorite is The General Line of Eisenstein.

I watched Dr Mabuse The Gambler a few days ago. The story of a criminal mastermind who gets insane in the end indeed reminds of Blofeld. While watching the movie I thought that it still would be great if Mr White would be the head of Quantum. The genius of villains like Mabuse was that they assumed different roles and so where elusive. (The modern counterpart to this is among others Keyser Söze in The Usual Suspects) Appearing as a henchman of Quantum could be the perfect camouflage for it´s head.

My favorite film of Lang is Frau im Mond (Woman on the moon). The interaction between art and science here is absolutely astonishing. Sometimes I wish this for contemporary sci-fi-movies. Space flight pioneer Hermann Oberth was technical adviser to the film, and the UFA financed him a rocket launch as a promotion gag. And the countdown that initiates rocket launches until today, was an idea of Lang to make the whole thing more thrilling. So many Bond finales with a countdown like Goldfinger or Octopussy have their origins in Fritz Lang.

It´s also interesting that by the time of Frau im Mond scientist thought that the surface of the moon must be covered with a thick layer of dust, because of the long time and the absent atmosphere (what is logical). So the moon looks like the Sahara in the film.

Always nice to find someone who shares the same passion as you... And quite well informed, too!

I am a proud owner of Frau Im mond, too. It is a fantastic film, and like I 've posted in another forum, very (suspiciously) similar to Tintin's Moon adventures.

[stromberg]

Just a quick FYI for te Fritz Lang fans out there:

the Premiere of the newly restored version of 'Metropolis' take place on the Berlin Film Festival today. It'll contain all the missing parts (which is said to be about half an hour in total), some of which have last been seen 83 years ago. The movie will be accompanied by a live orchestra which will perform the original music. If you can get German-French TV station 'arte', you can watch it there. But hurry up, it'll start in about ten minutes from now.

Further information and a link to a livestream (!) here: http://blogs.indysta...red_origin.html

[Tybre]

Thanks for that link, stromberg.

And may be old news, apparently a DVD release of the restoration is planned for December. That's one that will definitely be going into my collection.