1068 replies to this topic

[Single-O-Seven]

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

Captain Tightpants, on 03 March 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

We have no idea why Holmes was in the graveyard. I very much doubt it was to see who came to pay their respects. He's not a narcissit; he is a "high-functioning sociopath" (though I'd argue that he's probably got Asperger's). He may be there on a case.

A man who visits his own grave is not a narcassist?????

"On a case"? Involving his own graveyard??? Yeh, maybe he's investigating how Sherlock Holmes faked his own death!

Big raised eyebrow smilie to my first point; wink smilie to my second.

I suspect he was keeping an eye on Watson more so than his own grave. It may be that he really wanted to let Watson know his death was a hoax but even seeing Watson weeping at his graveside couldn't push him to do it just yet. Clearly, he is waiting for the right moment and needs to keep Watson out of danger. I'm guessing he wants to clean up some of Moriarty's people and I'm betting one of them - possibly the shooter who had his sights on Watson - turns out to be Col. Moran.

As an aside, My feeling is that the season three premiere will contain elements of The Empty House (quite obviously). Given that they want to explore Watson getting married and moving on, I bet we can also count on The Sign of Four cropping up. Prrsonally, I Would love to see some of the Red Headed League adapted.

[Dustin]

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

A man who visits his own grave is not a narcassist?????

Actually, if I had a chance to I'm pretty sure I would visit my own grave. You would not?

[David Schofield]

Dustin, on 03 March 2012 - 04:34 PM, said:

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

A man who visits his own grave is not a narcassist?????

Actually, if I had a chance to I'm pretty sure I would visit my own grave. You would not?

If I wasn't really dead, I would be more interested in letting those I loved know I was still alive than seeing the kind of monument they made for me.

If I were dead, of course I would. (But then, who says I'm not a narcasisst!)

Big smilie wink

[Dustin]

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 04:38 PM, said:

Dustin, on 03 March 2012 - 04:34 PM, said:

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

A man who visits his own grave is not a narcassist?????

Actually, if I had a chance to I'm pretty sure I would visit my own grave. You would not?

If I wasn't really dead, I would be more interested in letting those I loved know I was still alive than seeing the kind of monument they made for me.

If I were dead, of course I would. (But then, who says I'm not a narcasisst!)

Big smilie wink

Guess I'm a narcist, too. And that probably won't change when I'm dead...

[Aris007]

Another thing that deserves to be analysed is "Did Moriarty really die?".

I mean what if the image of Moriarty we get is really an actor? This would explain why Holmes said to Watson "Tell everyone I was a fraud.". In this way the real Moriarty would still look over his shoulder even after Holmes's suicide.

[Captain Tightpants]

Aris007, on 03 March 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

Firstly it's not clear where the killers were stationed. One was at Baker Str., the other was somewhere close to the scene of the suicide, but we don't know for sure. The sniper should have at a point from where he had clear vision of where Watson stood. So I'm guessing at a building next to St. Bart's.

The killers had orders to shoot if Holmes didn't jumo off the building. But Holmes did. He jumped on some sort of truck, which carried bags or something like that(I can't tell from the screenshot). Supposing that the killer had his eyes on Watson's moves and not on Holmes's fall he couldn't tell if Holmes killed himself or not.

Holmes would need to identify the location of the shooter before he jumped. I believe that is why he stopped Watson in his tracks - so that the shooter would be forced to expose himself to get a clear shot. But if the shooter was in another building and was watching Holmes, then Holmes would have to be confident that the shooter would not see him hit the ground. Even then, jumping into a truck would be difficult and dangerous, and would probably still kill him.

Basically, I think the idea that Holmes jumping onto a moving vehcile whilst Molly positioned a body made up to look like Holmes to be preposterous. It relies far too much on precise timing and precise angles, and events unfolding in certain ways. If so much as one of these is off, Holmes dies.

Aris007, on 03 March 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

Holmes picked the place of the meeting. This suggests that he had this in mind and probably was playing Moriarty from the beggining.

I'd argue that it's quite the opposite. If Holmes was playing Moriarty from the beginning, then he would have been able to prove that Moriarty was threatening the jury, and the story never would have gotten to the point where they encountered one another on the roof.

marktmurphy, on 03 March 2012 - 01:35 PM, said:

I think it's simply because, despite himself, he's actually genuinely fond of John.

I think Holmes is the kind of person who already knows that, and doesn't need to confirm it. Everything he said on the roof of St. Bart's was intended to reaffirm Watson's faith in him.

David Schofield, on 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

A man who visits his own grave is not a narcassist?????

"On a case"? Involving his own graveyard??? Yeh, maybe he's investigating how Sherlock Holmes faked his own death!

Remember when he was testing the noose on the mannequin? He may have been convinced that someone else staged their death and was visiting the graveyard to investigate.

[marktmurphy]

Captain Tightpants, on 03 March 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

Holmes would need to identify the location of the shooter before he jumped. I believe that is why he stopped Watson in his tracks - so that the shooter would be forced to expose himself to get a clear shot. But if the shooter was in another building and was watching Holmes, then Holmes would have to be confident that the shooter would not see him hit the ground. Even then, jumping into a truck would be difficult and dangerous, and would probably still kill him.

Well there's little doubt he jumped off the building unless there was a lot of editing trickery going on, and that would be a bit underhand. Sherlock jumping onto the lorry (which wasn't moving) which was filled with cardboard boxes or the like; not too hard to swallow. Then he jumps onto the ground and plays his own corpse.

[Aris007]

marktmurphy, on 04 March 2012 - 12:20 AM, said:

Captain Tightpants, on 03 March 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

Holmes would need to identify the location of the shooter before he jumped. I believe that is why he stopped Watson in his tracks - so that the shooter would be forced to expose himself to get a clear shot. But if the shooter was in another building and was watching Holmes, then Holmes would have to be confident that the shooter would not see him hit the ground. Even then, jumping into a truck would be difficult and dangerous, and would probably still kill him.

Well there's little doubt he jumped off the building unless there was a lot of editing trickery going on, and that would be a bit underhand. Sherlock jumping onto the lorry (which wasn't moving) which was filled with cardboard boxes or the like; not too hard to swallow. Then he jumps onto the ground and plays his own corpse.

That wouldn't explain the blood and the absence of pulse though.

The killer obviously(I sound like sherlock, I know) was opposite the hospital in the block of apartments. That's explained because he has a clear shot on Watson's head at the end of the episode. Now I suggest that the killer saw that Sherlock jumped on the track. After the fall Sherlock rolled over the track to the pavement like he was hurt from the impact. Then he followed the track as it got away and the body was put immediately at the spot where theoretically Sherlock would have been after he got off the truck. The killer thought, seeing the blood and the body that Sherlock died when he hit the track so he got away.

That's the most reasonable theory I can think of.

[marktmurphy]

What track do you mean?

The blood and absence of pulse aren't impossible to explain; Molly supplied him with some blood, a stooge takes his pulse. There was even an idea that he'd taken some sort of pulse-inhibiting drug (which apparently explains his earlier sweating or something; I can't remember- it's not my theory).

[Aris007]

marktmurphy, on 04 March 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

What track do you mean?

The blood and absence of pulse aren't impossible to explain; Molly supplied him with some blood, a stooge takes his pulse. There was even an idea that he'd taken some sort of pulse-inhibiting drug (which apparently explains his earlier sweating or something; I can't remember- it's not my theory).

I meant "truck", typing error. Truck, lorry call it what you like.

That's also an option, that Molly covered Holmes with blood, but the pulse-inhibiting drug is a bit far-fetched for me.

[killkenny kid]

http://www.pbs.org/w...piece/sherlock/

At last....

[Major Tallon]

At last indeed. The second series of "Sherlock" premieres tonight in the US.

[Single-O-Seven]

Major Tallon, on 06 May 2012 - 05:43 PM, said:

At last indeed. The second series of "Sherlock" premieres tonight in the US.

If you haven't seen it yet, you will be pleased. An excellent series of films. I'll say no more for now.

[jwheels]

Quick question for anyone who watched tonight: Was there a woman's voice doing a voice over the whole time? On my HD channel, there was a woman who sounded like she was reading from the script during the entire show, however when I switched it over to the SD channel, the voice over was gone. Just wondering if anyone else had this problem.

[Major Tallon]

Enjoyable as always; no constant female voiceover.

[Dustin]

You must have received the scene description for the hearing impaired.

[Dustin]

Nonsense! I meant blind!

[Arbogast777]

Liking the 2nd series but what is it about this show laying eggs for their 2nd episodes. I mean how can you make "Hounds" dull!?

Edited by Arbogast777, 18 May 2012 - 11:06 PM.

[Dustin]

I think that pilot is part of the first season DVD box, quite fun. But overall I prefer the aired version.